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Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

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Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#551

Post by brightball »

account42 wrote: post #509
brightball wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this won’t be popular but minimum wage shouldn’t exist. Basic income, sure but not minimum wage. Every discussion of minimum wage blames employers for something that is completely out of their control: inflation. When the price of gas, housing and food rises the business where you work doesn’t suddenly have more money to hand out. If anything their costs have gone up too reducing what they can afford to pay ou…

I agree that UBI would be better than minimum wages. Until we have UBI though (and it does not look like that it will be a reality anytime soon if only because those with wealth really don't like wealth redistribution schemes) minimum wage is the next best thing we have.

With UBI the entire conversation around inflation would shift to increasing UBI to compensate, which is a federal problem that would directly tie inflation to higher taxes. IMO it puts the conversation in the proper venue.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#552

Post by xapata »

quantum_magpie wrote: post #500
xapata wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with roommates?

Having roommates in a 1 bedroom apartment is quite terrible. You then need to convert (if there even is one) the living room to a second bedroom and as a result no one in the apartment has any privacy left. I have lived like that, and it's just not great for mental health.

Roommates in a bigger apartment or house is quite reasonable. 1-bedroom apartments are more than half the price of 2-bedroom apartments, so some efficiencies can be had by sharing a kitchen.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#553

Post by thghtihadanacct »

nostrademons wrote: post #327
thghtihadanacct wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds all well and good but I live in a desirable central coast city and thanks to SB9 I can now build 4 extra res units on my property. You are mistaken if you think anyone is going to spend that effort and charge anything less than current market ... maybe more, new houses are expensive. What we need is subsidized housing close to mass transit, single payer medicine, progressive tax reform and subsidized chil…

They don't have to charge less than market. They charge market rates and absorb 4 families that would've otherwise taken their market-rate salaries and kicked 4 immigrant families out of a 4-plex that used to rent far below market.

Section 8 are the only units that arent going to go up. Further, in my area 4 households moving to a property is not going to free up 4 local, otherwise cheap, units. New units in my area are going to attract higher-pay-than-average workers from San Jose or somewhere else in the bay area. I think one delusion is that many people think there is a single fix all. Its gonna be more than just build more housing. There are already millions of empty houses in the US.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#554

Post by njarboe »

dragonwriter wrote: post #447
njarboe wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people working for minimum wage (and probably most people in general in the US) work pay check to pay check (like the Applebee's manager stated in the article). They max out their available credit so that the interest takes up all of the possible slack in their income. Under UBI how to you prevent people from now borrowing more money (spending it on a vacation, clothes, fancier car, etc.), paying all the UBI as…

> Under UBI how to you prevent people from now borrowing more money (spending it on a vacation, clothes, fancier car, etc.), paying all the UBI as interest and ending up back in the same financial situation they were before. Don't make UBI subject to garnishment/attachment to pay debt and exclude it from income considered available when determining bankruptcy terms. Lending behavior under those conditions will preven…

Most people in financial distress don't do bankruptcy. They run up their credit cards/car loans/etc. till the interest payments are high enough that they are living paycheck-to-paycheck. They get stuck in that situation. I think in the US only the government can garnish wages. Private entities can only bug you a lot and wreck your credit. I just don't think UBI solves the poverty problem like many people think. But I sure would like some country to try it to see what happens.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#555

Post by breadbreadbread »

nostrademons wrote: post #208
endisneigh wrote: post #3

I wonder what the USA would look like if minimum wage was defined as; two people being able to afford a 1 bedroom apartment within a 1 hour drive without traffic. The static (both in the nominal and inflation adjusted sense) for minimum wage doesn't make sense imo. Minimum wage should be tied to some level of living (not necessarily a great living, but something ) This guy smh

Inflation, probably followed by corruption. Minimum wage would rise to the point where a person could afford a 1BR apartment within a 1 hour drive without traffic. Then the rents of those 1BR apartments would rise to capture that new minimum wage. Then minimum wage would rise to afford the new rent, and so on. Eventually someone's going to say "Hey, I own an apartment block downtown, I'm supposed to rent it out to th…

rent control

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#556

Post by salawat »

cbar_tx wrote: post #541
greiskul wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is also the Georgian explanation that rent seeking landlords will always increase rent to match any gains in production. Assuming that a landlord will always charge the maximum they can that market will sustain, any increase in production will mean an increase in what the market can pay for housing, and with time, what the landlord can extract from tenants. It neatly explains how cost of living correlates to jo…

if you want to live in my house, and within the safe and comfortable legal framework of tenancy in a property lease contact, then you have to pay competitive market rates to live there. "Pay your fair share" to the "rent seekers" if it is a place to live that you are seeking...

This falls apart when the rent seeker refuses to sell, or prices the sale out of the reach of first time buyers.

I can't square a landlord running empty properties when the economy colludes to keep people from buying properties.

Homes should not be straight up financial instruments.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#557

Post by xyzzyz »

ummwhat wrote: post #282
nostrademons wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inflation, probably followed by corruption. Minimum wage would rise to the point where a person could afford a 1BR apartment within a 1 hour drive without traffic. Then the rents of those 1BR apartments would rise to capture that new minimum wage. Then minimum wage would rise to afford the new rent, and so on. Eventually someone's going to say "Hey, I own an apartment block downtown, I'm supposed to rent it out to th…

My pet theory is cities are malthusian. Contrary to popular belief, Malthus didn't predict runaway population growth. What he actually predicted (and was right for most of human history), is that any gains in productivity would be eaten up by population growth until the average wealth per person diluted down to it's previous level. So back to cities. Here's my pet theory. You build more apartments, or faster trains o…

> This dynamic works because unlike pre industrial malthusian times, cities do not rely on birthrates for population growth.

The same was true in pre-industrial times too. The cities have always been population sinks, and failed to reproduce naturally. They have always been supplied by the constant stream of people from countryside.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#558

Post by xyzzyz »

throw123123123 wrote: post #492
ummwhat wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My pet theory is cities are malthusian. Contrary to popular belief, Malthus didn't predict runaway population growth. What he actually predicted (and was right for most of human history), is that any gains in productivity would be eaten up by population growth until the average wealth per person diluted down to it's previous level. So back to cities. Here's my pet theory. You build more apartments, or faster trains o…

Malthus is the butt-joke of economics, so much it became a rite of passage to mock him. Marx's Capital and Henry George's Poverty and Progress dedicate some time to his humiliation.

> Malthus is the butt-joke of economics

Uh, he's not?

> Marx's Capital

Oh, that kind of "economics". Never mind then.

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#559

Post by throw123123123 »

xyzzyz wrote: post #558
throw123123123 wrote: post #492

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Malthus is the butt-joke of economics, so much it became a rite of passage to mock him. Marx's Capital and Henry George's Poverty and Progress dedicate some time to his humiliation.

> Malthus is the butt-joke of economics Uh, he's not? > Marx's Capital Oh, that kind of "economics". Never mind then.

Malthus's arithmetic vs geometric model of population is grossly wrong, while also condemns a large swath of humanity to extreme poverty. What a clown.

Paraphrasing Henry George: "Malthus model that food grows arithmetically and population grows geometrically is as arbitrary as saying a dog grows arithmetically and his tail grows geometrically"

> Oh, that kind of "economics". Never mind then.

What is that "kind of economics"?

Re: Applebee’s exec urges using high gas prices to push lower wages, sparks walkout

#560

Post by yazaddaruvala »

dragonwriter wrote: post #543
yazaddaruvala wrote: post #540

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The win-win-win was for "Removal/reduction in zoning", "Automate construction approval workflows", "Leverage eminent domain to aggregate land". UBI doesn't work well at all, like you stated, if there isn't a big increase in the supply of housing. For example, Seattle needs 10x more housing than it has today, and in 10 years it'll need 100x more housing than it has today. Ideally, all of these should be new luxury con…

> For example, Seattle needs 10x more housing than it has today, and in 10 years it'll need 100x more housing than it has today. Seattle has about 740k people and about 370k housing units. 10 times the housing units would be enough for the entire state population at an average occupancy of 2 persons/unit. 100 times would be enough for roughly every US state bordering on or one state out from the Pacific Ocean. Seattl…

Greater Seattle has 3MM people many of whom would like to be in the city core in a 3000sqft lux condo instead, or Airbnb space for concert nights. You’re also greatly underestimating the number of people from around the US who would rather live in Seattle but just can’t afford it right now. Seattle has a labor shortage and just can’t fill it right now. Restaurants and even many bars close early because it’s not cost effective to stay open later.

Density also facilitates business and pulls in even more workers, who are also customers and it’s a positive cycle.

Seattle needs 100x more housing in the next 10 years if it wants to continue to be a competitive city. As a resident I sure hope it does.

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