Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

fsf.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 209 posts

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#191

Post by ipnon »

cobbzilla wrote: post #143
usrbinbash wrote: post #137

Everytime someone invokes an argument how taking something away by law prevents some form of crime, my answer is a simple fact: Criminals, by definition, don't follow the law. Now, in some cases, that isn't a problem: Guns are an obvious example, because they take resources and knowledge to manufacture, and are physical objects that can be tracked. Taking these away by law works. But encryption isn't a physical objec…

“..because they take resources and knowledge to manufacture, and are physical objects that can be tracked. Taking these away by law works.” Sorry but it doesn’t even work for physical objects. Guns are completely illegal in some cities (NYC, SF and Chicago, unless you have connections), so I suppose there’s no gun crime there, right? Or, research compliance rates when states have retroactively made certain firearms i…

Good point, but guns are legal in NYC. If you have a dangerous job like a security guard, you can get an open carry permit. If you have no special circumstances, you can own a gun in your home. The gun can be transported to other destinations like a shooting range, your business, or other homes, as long as the gun is locked in a container during transit. Until recently you could only carry the gun between your home and a shooting ranges within the city, but the law was expanded due to a current lawsuit against the City.

edit: Most gun crimes in the city are done with illegal guns, 74% of which come from out of state. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/10/26/13418208/...

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#192

Post by CrazyPyroLinux »

strofcon wrote: post #159
roenxi wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The FSF isn't the EFF. The FSF is supposed to advocate why the stupid law is an affront to user freedom and the EFF is meant to be advocating why the stupid law makes people vulnerable to criminals. The FSF has a complicated and niche advocacy position, they should stay focused. If they don't advocate software user freedom, nobody will. In this case, there are already lots of people against encryption restrictions.

Seems to me that banning encryption would thoroughly limit software freedoms. Ie:can't use anything secure, thus can't freely choose your toolset.

Exactly. Per the famous https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.en.html

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#193

Post by brightball »

miloignis wrote: post #185
brightball wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maxmind API's will identify Tor traffic pretty reliably fwiw. I tried Tor one time years ago when I was testing Maxmind. It always seemed like if you were using it you'd become an exit node by default (I could be completely wrong on this, I haven't looked into deeply). Just gave me the impression that my IP address would suddenly be associated with whatever anyone else was doing and that seemed...bad. Totally underst…

Exit nodes are specifically set up and run, you do not become one by default. Using the Tor browser doesn't even make you a relay node: https://support.torproject.org/tbb/tbb-33/

That’s good to know.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#194

Post by CrazyPyroLinux »

anonporridge wrote: post #178
boredumb wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Making encryption illegal will ensure that only criminals use it, thus making only criminals safe online." Uptown NYC has a tragically similar problem with fire arms.

"Making dealing drugs illegal will ensure that only criminals can profit off dealing drugs, thus making only criminals rich." We can play this game all day with many forms of abolition for any good or service that has a relatively inelastic demand and/or is impossible to effectively enforce.

Ok, lets do that. "War on Drugs" has been disastrous.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#195

Post by anonporridge »

CrazyPyroLinux wrote: post #194
anonporridge wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Making dealing drugs illegal will ensure that only criminals can profit off dealing drugs, thus making only criminals rich." We can play this game all day with many forms of abolition for any good or service that has a relatively inelastic demand and/or is impossible to effectively enforce.

Ok, lets do that. "War on Drugs" has been disastrous.

100% agree.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#196

Post by nobody9999 »

Beltiras wrote: post #138
vitiral wrote: post #20

I feel like they missed the primary point which is that E2E encryption is the primary thing protecting everyone from hackers/criminals/other-governments. Without it the criminals WILL have access to your systems and data and then you can basically say goodbye to anything being valuable at all. Locking your door at night is a poor metaphor. A criminal can literally infiltrate and search through every unsecured compute…

In that case everyone should become a criminal.

>In that case everyone should become a criminal.

While it is somewhat hyperbolic, *Three Felonies a Day"[0][1] seems relevant here.

[0] https://www.amazon.com/Three-Felonies-Day-Target-Innocent/dp...

[1] https://www.c-span.org/video/?289272-1/three-felonies-day

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#197

Post by fsflover »

vegetablepotpie wrote: post #180
docmars wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The right to privacy, and protections against unreasonable search and seizure are enshrined in the U.S. Constitution after all!

Yes, and the government has created convenient carve outs for its self. For example in Carroll v. United States, the judicial branch surrendered its authority to authorize searches to the executive branch. For searches of your vehicle, all the police need is probable cause. The police, of course, determine if they have probable cause. So this makes the 4th amendment irrelevant in these circumstances. Throughout US hi…

> The police, of course, determine if they have probable cause. So this makes the 4th amendment irrelevant in these circumstances.

Can't you go to the court if you disagree that they had a probable cause?

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#198

Post by Beltiras »

nobody9999 wrote: post #196
Beltiras wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In that case everyone should become a criminal.

>In that case everyone should become a criminal. While it is somewhat hyperbolic, *Three Felonies a Day"[0][1] seems relevant here. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Three-Felonies-Day-Target-Innocent/dp... [1] https://www.c-span.org/video/?289272-1/three-felonies-day

In my opinion it's the duty of an enlightened citizen to break unjust laws. Civil disobedience is the only thing that will right a wrong like that.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#199

Post by nobody9999 »

Beltiras wrote: post #198
nobody9999 wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In that case everyone should become a criminal. While it is somewhat hyperbolic, *Three Felonies a Day"[0][1] seems relevant here. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Three-Felonies-Day-Target-Innocent/dp... [1] https://www.c-span.org/video/?289272-1/three-felonies-day

In my opinion it's the duty of an enlightened citizen to break unjust laws. Civil disobedience is the only thing that will right a wrong like that.

>In my opinion it's the duty of an enlightened citizen to break unjust laws. Civil disobedience is the only thing that will right a wrong like that.

You won't get an argument about that from me. I was merely pointing out that the legal landscape is already filled with land mines.

Which is why (among other things) you should never talk to the police[0].

[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpUx-WFXT9k

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#200

Post by nidble »

noisy_boy wrote: post #33

I have said this before: this is a losing battle for individuals striving to protect the freedom, if we just try to do it individually. People bringing this get paid to do this during office time (and maybe after office time too by lobbyists) so they will keep at this; my protests require me to do it by taking time out of the limited time I have left after office. Fight fire with fire, fund EFF so that we have our ow…

Also EFF has always been among the charities available in Humble Bundle.
Post reply on HN