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Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

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Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#181

Post by anonporridge »

indigochill wrote: post #122
seanw444 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Making crypto illegal will ensure that only criminals have the ability to use it. The right to bear digital arms.

This is an interesting angle I´d not heard before, as cryptography had at least at some point been classified as munitions (maybe still is, I haven't been watching that). "Okay, in that case, the constitution says you can't infringe my right to it." Although I would fear going down that path would lead to them saying, "Well, we already infringe on access to certain kinds of munitions, so you can still have encryption…

Interesting bit of history, PGP was publicly released by Phil Zimmermann. The US government went after him with criminal charges for violating munitions export laws.

He won because he published his source code in a printed book, and was able to effectively argue that his act was protected under the first amendment right to free speech.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pretty_Good_Privacy#Criminal_i...

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#182

Post by [deleted] »

indigochill wrote: post #122
seanw444 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Making crypto illegal will ensure that only criminals have the ability to use it. The right to bear digital arms.

This is an interesting angle I´d not heard before, as cryptography had at least at some point been classified as munitions (maybe still is, I haven't been watching that). "Okay, in that case, the constitution says you can't infringe my right to it." Although I would fear going down that path would lead to them saying, "Well, we already infringe on access to certain kinds of munitions, so you can still have encryption…

[deleted]

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#183

Post by xhkkffbf »

docmars wrote: post #162
fsflover wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Banning encryption is such an attack on privacy that it's closer to banning clothes and easing concerns by making looking at naked people illegal. This is completely missing the point of why one needs privacy. Lack of it harms journalism and activism, making the government too powerful and not accountable. If only activists and journalists will try to have the privacy, it will be much easier to target them. Everyon…

The right to privacy, and protections against unreasonable search and seizure are enshrined in the U.S. Constitution after all!

Unreasonable search and seizure is written out explicitly but privacy is not.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#184

Post by anonporridge »

seanw444 wrote: post #91
vitiral wrote: post #20

I feel like they missed the primary point which is that E2E encryption is the primary thing protecting everyone from hackers/criminals/other-governments. Without it the criminals WILL have access to your systems and data and then you can basically say goodbye to anything being valuable at all. Locking your door at night is a poor metaphor. A criminal can literally infiltrate and search through every unsecured compute…

> Making crypto illegal will ensure that only criminals have the ability to use it. The right to bear digital arms.

We already have it. The first amendment.

> Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech...

Cryptographic communication is speech.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#185

Post by miloignis »

brightball wrote: post #172
LMYahooTFY wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did they ever present you with evidence of anything? From what I've heard it's quite possible to identify Tor traffic if you're determined enough. Perhaps they were pressuring you because they thought you were running a relay/node?

Maxmind API's will identify Tor traffic pretty reliably fwiw. I tried Tor one time years ago when I was testing Maxmind. It always seemed like if you were using it you'd become an exit node by default (I could be completely wrong on this, I haven't looked into deeply). Just gave me the impression that my IP address would suddenly be associated with whatever anyone else was doing and that seemed...bad. Totally underst…

Exit nodes are specifically set up and run, you do not become one by default. Using the Tor browser doesn't even make you a relay node: https://support.torproject.org/tbb/tbb-33/

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#186

Post by anonporridge »

asimpletune wrote: post #119

Banning encryption is basically banning certain maths. In a way, it's an affront on free speech, because it is explicitly saying speech must be done in a way that can always be eavesdropped. An analogy I use to explain to people who don't have a technical background is, "Imagine if we made it law that every pen ever made was required to be chained to a special clipboard that makes a carbon copy of whatever the pen wr…

Another analogy I like, is that it's akin to banning people from inventing new languages that nobody else understands. It's like adults banning a form of piglatin their kids made up just because they can't decipher what the kids are saying to each other.

Cryptography is just a special kind of speech/language that is theoretically impossible to understand without the consensual invitation of the speakers.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#187

Post by wesapien »

vitiral wrote: post #20

I feel like they missed the primary point which is that E2E encryption is the primary thing protecting everyone from hackers/criminals/other-governments. Without it the criminals WILL have access to your systems and data and then you can basically say goodbye to anything being valuable at all. Locking your door at night is a poor metaphor. A criminal can literally infiltrate and search through every unsecured compute…

Missing the point is part of their strategy in passing this. They don't make these decisions without input from people who actually understand these things. They will play the tech illiterate boomer as part of the strategy. They're creating "rules for thee not for me". They will selectively choose who can and can't use things they see as a threat to their hegemony.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#188

Post by vharuck »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #54
galoisscobi wrote: post #30

Wrote to Dianne Feinstein of CA about being against Earn-IT act and got a letter back about how Earn IT act would prevent child sexual abuse material online. Sigh. As disappointed as I was in the response, I'm glad that EFF makes it really easy to reach out to reps. Took me less than a minute to send out my stance against the Earn IT act to my representatives https://act.eff.org/action/stop-the-earn-it-act-to-save-ou…

Do politicians even read these letters?

Depends on the politician. A few years ago, I wrote emails to my US House representative and one of my senators. They didn't come from a template. I wrote a few short paragraphs stating my wish, my reasons, and a bit of praise for something they recently did.

The representative sent back an obvious copy-paste. Could've been the response to any email about the topic, and sounded like a campaign pitch.

The senator (or at least a staffer) replied with reasoning. I didn't agree with the reasoning or conclusion, but somebody definitely read my email and responded specifically to it. I appreciated the respect they showed that way.

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#189

Post by epicide »

anonporridge wrote: post #184
seanw444 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Making crypto illegal will ensure that only criminals have the ability to use it. The right to bear digital arms.

We already have it. The first amendment. > Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech... Cryptographic communication is speech.

This makes me wonder how one would even prove that something were encrypted.

Do encrypted files/data universally follow any sort of pattern? If not, then how would they be discernible from transmitting random bits? Will that be illegal, too?

Note that I'm not talking about any specific existing encryption algorithms or protocols. I am positing that someone could devise a new one that outputs data that is indistinguishable from noise (without breaking the cipher/keys).

Re: Earn-IT threatens encryption and therefore user freedom

#190

Post by anonporridge »

epicide wrote: post #189
anonporridge wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We already have it. The first amendment. > Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech... Cryptographic communication is speech.

This makes me wonder how one would even prove that something were encrypted. Do encrypted files/data universally follow any sort of pattern? If not, then how would they be discernible from transmitting random bits? Will that be illegal, too? Note that I'm not talking about any specific existing encryption algorithms or protocols. I am positing that someone could devise a new one that outputs data that is indistinguis…

You could encode encrypted data in cat pictures and post them on Instagram.

It's likely completely impossible to actually ban encryption in a world overwhelmed with information flow.

Therefore, an encryption ban will only effect law abiding citizens and will give criminals a massively asymmetric weapon of power and influence.

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