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Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

reuters.com

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Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#431

Post by formerlurker »

MichaelMoser123 wrote: post #312

https://www.pravda.com.ua/rus/news/2022/03/4/7328008/ (link in Russian, that's a big newspaper in Ukraine) the units of chechen warlord Kadyrov are fighting inside the building of the power station, and are said to be laying mines, as a means of exerting pressure. What could go wrong... This kadyrov is totally mad, they introduced Sharia law in their chechen republic, and putin doesn't want to interfer with this madn…

Thank you for pointing out that the plant is 6 times bigger. I watched the HBO series Chernobyl and it opened my eyes to the dangers of a nuclear meltdown. I hope the new containment tech is enough to avoid a disaster.

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#432

Post by eru »

TillE wrote: post #368
sidibe wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't surprise me if they believe that considering the ridiculous stream of fantasy being spewed out of Russian leader and media.

Every country has its propaganda and lies, but they're generally couched in half-truths. It's truly remarkable how the Russian flavor of misinformation sounds just like a pathological liar making up wild bullshit that nobody could possibly take seriously. That's been a tradition for decades, as far as I know.

Keep in mind that you are likely seeing the Russian propaganda through a filter of western propaganda and interpretation.

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#433

Post by eru »

jeromegv wrote: post #393
TillE wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every country has its propaganda and lies, but they're generally couched in half-truths. It's truly remarkable how the Russian flavor of misinformation sounds just like a pathological liar making up wild bullshit that nobody could possibly take seriously. That's been a tradition for decades, as far as I know.

I mean… Trump was lying about how many electoral votes he got. It was easily verifiable. Also such a stupid lie because he did have enough electoral votes to win the election anyway. But still! He fabricated that number. He was also truly in pathological liar territory.

Gave him free media attention without any more media dislike than he already suffered, I guess?

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#434

Post by eru »

redwall_hp wrote: post #326
jliptzin wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t one major problem with nuclear is that it’s hard to shut down when you don’t need it? Hopefully they understand that

Usually they have fail safes that will more or less immediately shut them down. On any reactor designed in the last 50 years, they pretty much default to a safe state, as they require power to keep the failsafes open. Starting back up after is the slow part.

No clue how old the Ukrainian reactor (and its design) is. Perhaps more than 50 years?

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#435

Post by eru »

ck2 wrote: post #428
boringg wrote: post #274

So, aside from the obvious nature of messing around with Nuclear generating station being an idiotic move. From a tactical move for Russia - clearly they want the generating station offline to cause further chaos in Ukraine and that it supplies 1/6 of the power I believe(?). Was the generating station fighting to say online / not surrender or did Russia just show up guns blazing? It's clearly a tactically important s…

Purposely causing nuclear disasters is one way to ensure a country can never join NATO or the EU Putin doesn't have to occupy the country to "win", all he has to do is set them back to the dark ages and make everyone (who can) flee. He can't be allowed to get away with this. Ukraine needs a "no fly zone" ASAP

> Purposely causing nuclear disasters is one way to ensure a country can never join NATO or the EU

Why? Nuclear disaster is bad, but how would it ensure that a country can _never_ join NATO or the EU?

Ukraine already had the Chernobyl disaster on their soil, and I don't see that one as keeping them out of either organisation _forever_.

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#436

Post by throwawaylinux »

d23 wrote: post #412
jeromegv wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean… Trump was lying about how many electoral votes he got. It was easily verifiable. Also such a stupid lie because he did have enough electoral votes to win the election anyway. But still! He fabricated that number. He was also truly in pathological liar territory.

I'll take the downvotes too. We had a president who idolized Putin and still praises him to this day. If we think this sort of thing can't happen here, or aren't clear eyed about the threat he and his enablers still pose, we are in even more danger.

Yes, propaganda and political lies is certainly not confined to Russia or backwater dictatorships. In America you also had that president's opponents concocting lies and peddling insane and baseless conspiracy theories for years about him colluding with Putin to hack the election and other such nonsense. That was even more infantile and simple than the propaganda that comes out of Russia.

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#437

Post by fabrika »

ck2 wrote: post #428
boringg wrote: post #274

So, aside from the obvious nature of messing around with Nuclear generating station being an idiotic move. From a tactical move for Russia - clearly they want the generating station offline to cause further chaos in Ukraine and that it supplies 1/6 of the power I believe(?). Was the generating station fighting to say online / not surrender or did Russia just show up guns blazing? It's clearly a tactically important s…

Purposely causing nuclear disasters is one way to ensure a country can never join NATO or the EU Putin doesn't have to occupy the country to "win", all he has to do is set them back to the dark ages and make everyone (who can) flee. He can't be allowed to get away with this. Ukraine needs a "no fly zone" ASAP

Putin might nuke Warsaw an hour after the no-fly zone is imposed. He's that crazy.

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#438

Post by monocasa »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #409
HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The risks of nuclear war from a NATO militarily intervention are far too high to even consider it. I’m sorry to say, but there is really nothing that could happen in Ukraine that would be bad enough for us to accept the risk of nuclear annihilation.

You could say this about any military aggression from Russia though. "Putin taking Estonia isn't as bad as nuclear annihilation." "Putin taking Berlin isn't as bad as nuclear annihilation." "Putin taking DC isn't as bad as nuclear annihilation." What if he just goes, "I'm invading western Europe now too, and if you fight back I launch the nukes"? Do we just roll over and say that it's better to surrender than fight?

All of those countries are NATO members.

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#439

Post by KingOfCoders »

MichaelMoser123 wrote: post #312

https://www.pravda.com.ua/rus/news/2022/03/4/7328008/ (link in Russian, that's a big newspaper in Ukraine) the units of chechen warlord Kadyrov are fighting inside the building of the power station, and are said to be laying mines, as a means of exerting pressure. What could go wrong... This kadyrov is totally mad, they introduced Sharia law in their chechen republic, and putin doesn't want to interfer with this madn…

"and putin doesn't want to interfer with this madness"

Putin installed Kadyrov.

"On 2 March 2007, following Putin's nomination of Kadyrov as Chechen president, the Chechen parliament approved the nomination." Wikipedia

Re: Fire extinguished at Ukraine nuclear power plant, Europe's largest

#440

Post by eru »

wyager wrote: post #390
eyelidlessness wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can’t speak to why you’ve been downvoted, but it might be worth considering the incentives to fight aren’t the same between the “sides”. One is fighting to survive an attack by the other. It’s difficult to maintain safety measures while people are trying to kill you.

> One is fighting to survive an attack by the other. This statement, while true, changes denotation depending on the scale at which you view this conflict. If you view it as a conflict between Russia and Ukraine, the existential threat is to Ukraine. If you view it as a conflict between Russia and NATO, the existential threat is to Russia.

I don't agree 100%, but I don't think you deserve the downvotes.

I think you could say in the wider scale it can be interpreted as an existential threat to Putin's Russia?

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