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Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

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Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#691

Post by bvrmn »

forinti wrote: post #611
bvrmn wrote: post #548

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no such thing like Russian soul. But Bolshevist legacy and Checkist persons in control. See how Korea was split and become completely different countries from the same people.

They are different countries but still they are very strict, hierarchical, conformist societies, and so is Japan. I think maybe it's just the same mindset put into different economic systems.

South Korea and Japan has a history of changing a ruling person by non-election means. It's the only thing that matters for stable democracy. Ukrainian and Russian situation is very similar. Propaganda poisoned people and there are no enough free minds to stand against Putin.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#692

Post by oulipo »

cbg0 wrote: post #256
oulipo wrote: post #246

Are you seriously trying to help Russians evade sanctions that the West want to put on them? Not sure what you are trying to do with this

I don't think you understand what "evade sanctions" actually means. OP is telling people to prepare for the impact of sanctions.

That's exactly what I'm saying. The point of those sanctions is to hurt the Russian economy. Here the OP is a western guy trying to tell people in Russia how to minimize the effect of those sanctions.

Don't get me wrong, I wish that there was no war, and that everybody could live in peace and prosperity, in Ukraine and in Russia, but what OP does is trying to limit the impact of our economical sanctions on the Russian economy

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#693

Post by dncornholio »

JGM_io wrote: post #549
pydry wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying "Ukraine will remain neutral and will not join NATO" would have stopped this war. It's an unpopular fact but it's still true.

Also nato not expanding towards russian borders even after promising it wouldn't by james baker, 1990[1] [1] https://ibb.co/xgqRWG3

32 years ago some guy thought he could make this decision for half of Europe. I'm so shocked! NATO seems a real threat! Look at how the NATO oppresses their people, bring no economic growth and just made the countries so much worse to live in!

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#694

Post by redwood »

fulvioterzapi wrote: post #313
redwood wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure I get it: are you saying you do not believe the international community should hold Russia accountable for its murderous incomprehensible actions in Europe?

The USA has a longer story of military aggressions, that killed far, far, far more people. Do you think Amazon should stop doing business with the USA, or are you saying you do not believe the international community should hold the USA accountable for their murderous incomprehensible actions around the world?

It's that it's Europe and yes the western democracies have a double standard of looking out for each other and near adjadcencies above other countries needs but that's because there's so much more to lose in terms of institutions that are very hard to build and can unfortunately very quickly be torn down.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#695

Post by dragonwriter »

d0mine wrote: post #608
sakopov wrote: post #472

The reason Russia has elevated tyrants to power for centuries is deep-rooted in Russian soul to the point where it's not even a problem. It's something that is inexplicably difficult to understand unless you actually experience the culture for a good portion of your life. There is a lot of literature out there about the "Russian Soul" and I really recommend reading it to understand how this happens. In my opinion it'…

This reminds how europeans justified slavery: "they are barbarians. We are making them a favor by owning them. We give them civilization" btw, russians are officially considered colored in US as I understand.

> btw, russians are officially considered colored in US as I understand.

“Colored” is not something one is “officially considered” in the US on the basis of national origin, so you are wrong not only in detail but even on broad outline.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#696

Post by dncornholio »

sakopov wrote: post #472

The reason Russia has elevated tyrants to power for centuries is deep-rooted in Russian soul to the point where it's not even a problem. It's something that is inexplicably difficult to understand unless you actually experience the culture for a good portion of your life. There is a lot of literature out there about the "Russian Soul" and I really recommend reading it to understand how this happens. In my opinion it'…

This 'mentality' is just believing in the propaganda out of fear. I'm not going to look into it because it's just lies.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#697

Post by buran77 »

belorn wrote: post #422
squarefoot wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chechnya war also was very close and nobody cared since they were mostly Islamic, and the war in the former Yugoslavia happened just in the middle of Europe, but apparently many have already lost memory of it despite the atrocities committed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

Media and news looked a bit difference in 1992, and it was mostly seen as an civil war of the former Yugoslavia rather than an invasion force of one country entering an other country in order to capture land. It seemed to have more similarities with the situation in Northern Ireland than with Lebensraum. Lebensraum really scares people. Religious conflict are concerning, but the French wasn't directly worried that th…

It's not just the media reporting in itself as much as how concerned people are about the suffering that happens during that war. Sure people watched Iraq's invasion of Kuwait on TV but most of the Western world was free to watch it with detachment and just a tiniest bit of worry. There has been constant fighting in the Middle East for decades but it's just too far away for people in the West to process that concern, or to blame the countries committing those atrocities (whether Russia or the US). It's "countries far away we don't like anyway", "people who aren't like us anyway".

Now it's close to home, happening to people like us. Now it's a genuine concern and those who are close enough in Europe are forced to process those worries, go through them, make scenarios, visualize the loss because it may be their loss soon.

When Russia was bombing the hell out of Syria very few people felt the visceral hate or fear they feel now. And I bet far fewer people remember that this is even more recent than the Crimean invasion and that they've kept bombing Syria well into 2021. When Russia was invading Georgia we just watched the news and shook our heads. Same when Russia and Turkey were fighting their proxy wars in the Caucasus, Western and Central Asia. All too far from us to care.

It was all about thoughts and prayers until the bombs hit close to home.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#698

Post by roca »

sudosysgen wrote: post #45
marcell wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin launched a war against Ukraine in order to conquer it the traditional sense, ie to replace the existing government with his own government. The long term goal is for Russia to control this country's government. The wars started by the US typically have the goal of establishing a democratic government. Japan is an example of a successful outcome. Iraq has a functioning democracy now. This policy is often critici…

The US replaced the governments of multiple countries with its puppets, see Afghanistan. Try to tell me with a straight face that the previous Afghan government was democratic and represented the will of the Afghan people. You cannot. Iraq's democracy is about as successful as Russia's, that is, not at all. The US installed a dictatorship in South Korea, and overthrew or contributed in the overthrow of many more.

The US-supported Afghan government wasn't worse than the governments before or after it.

South Korea's an interesting example. It was a dictatorship, now it's a thriving democracy. Ditto for Japan, Taiwan, West Germany. Sometimes things turn out alright.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#699

Post by ssijak »

squarefoot wrote: post #302
kungito wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been multiple active wars in like 1/4 of the world the whole time since ww2 and all the time before that. The only thing different is that Ukraine is closer to EU than the rest of the countries.

Chechnya war also was very close and nobody cared since they were mostly Islamic, and the war in the former Yugoslavia happened just in the middle of Europe, but apparently many have already lost memory of it despite the atrocities committed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

Many atrocities on all sides. You already mentioned the biggest one committed by Bosnian Serb army.

Mujahideens volunteering in Bosnia and creating a muslim army and committing numerous crimes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosnian_mujahideen

Croatian army ethnically cleansing croatian territory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Storm

Kosovo Albanian Liberation Army which was designated as terrorist organization by the US, but that conveniently changed before NATO bombing of Yugoslavia committing their share of crimes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo_Liberation_Army

Than there is also NATO bombing destroying numerous civilian targets and killing civilians on all sides https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_during_Ope...

etc etc.

So many atrocities, where one is too many. I long for the day where each side will punish all their vile murderers and crime doers and not as it is often done, protect them, excuse them, or even celebrate them after the wars. Or even better, when ordinary people would not fall for the propaganda of their countries and stop wars from even happening.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#700

Post by T-A »

tut-urut-utut wrote: post #491
drran wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why US was in Afghanistan in the first place? Uh, they blow up American city...

Wasn't that a citizen of the US ally Saudi Arabia that "blew up American city"? Why didn't you destroy Saudi Arabia instead? Because they pay their tribute in oil, and you had to destroy "someone", and Afghanistan was the first in the alphabetical list of countries that met the criteria for destruction?

The fact that said citizen of Saudi Arabia was based in Afghanistan and protected by the country's Taliban rulers may have had something to do with that...
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