Tell HN: If You Are in Russia • Hacker News Board

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#271

Post by nathias » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

redwood wrote: post #231

freddealmeida wrote: post #222

This anti-Russian trope spreading is infuriating. If Apple and Google can stop their Pay services, of course everything else will be stopped. But that also means I don't want to be on those services either. It is too much power to give to Amazon, Microsoft and Google. I will actively move my own services to solutions that don't act like arms of the US government.

I'm not sure I get it: are you saying you do not believe the international community should hold Russia accountable for its murderous incomprehensible actions in Europe?

They aren't holding Russia accountable, they holding Russians accountable and that seems like a terrible thing.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#272

Post by imranhou » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

darebak wrote: post #124

lucky1759 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here you go: https://www.rferl.org/a/yugoslavia-hague-tribunal-major-mome... https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/bosnian-serb-military-l... Multiple ethnic "serbs" were convicted of genociding muslims.

That's not a source that tells Serbia committed a genocide, because such source doesn't exist. Ethnic Serbs in Bosnia are a different thing, same as ethnic Bosniak in Serbia are a different thing. Also I found it telling that used Serbs in quotation marks.

Just arguing about naming doesn't erase the bottom line that lots of people were grouped in camps, murdered and raped...

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#273

Post by 878654Tom » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

teekert wrote: post #234

kungito wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been multiple active wars in like 1/4 of the world the whole time since ww2 and all the time before that. The only thing different is that Ukraine is closer to EU than the rest of the countries.

Yes I realize it is perhaps hypocritical, but somehow I thought we had figured it out. I mean we (EU and US) also could have done more talking less warmongering. I’m also disappointed with our leaders.

You missed the whole period of months of diplomatic communications between EU, China, US, Ukraine and Russia before Russian started the attack.

In all those months it seems that only China and the Winter Olympics really did delay the attack.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#274

Post by ithkuil » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

all_factz wrote: post #166

sudosysgen wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure many people in the US were opposed to it. Did they have a choice though? Both of those wars were essentially unanimous amongst the ruling class. There is nothing the average citizen can do at that point. You claim “this isn’t about the human suffering caused by Russia”. You sure about that? I think most people feel like a primary issue with invading another country is the amount of human suffering it causes.…

I think you’re still oversimplifying. NATO countries may have been involved in bloody wars, wars which were varying degrees of bad idea, but at least those wars were fought against regimes which were terrible - brutal and repressive towards their own population. Ukraine is a mostly liberal democracy, which makes invading it even harder to justify. But sure, US citizens might not have had much say in whether the US in…

It's not unlikely that sanctions against USA because of Iraq or Afghanistan would have fueled USssian nationalism to an extent that makes the current right look like a fairy tale. Sure, there would be people protesting against the government because they would want them to reverse course but there would be people who would react in the precise opposite way and they would want to cave in. Pride is a strong human emotion.

The Russian aggression case is much clear cut, but it may not look like it is clear cut if you live inside a different information bubble (especially if you want to believe that your country did nothing wrong, or that it's just "an internal matter", or that "we don't want foreign missiles at our doorstep; the USA wouldn't want Russian missiles at cube why should we accept ".

What we're learning in this day and age is that information poisoning cannot be cured by just throwing more information.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#275

Post by Andrew_nenakhov » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #257

teekert wrote: post #180

This whole situation is so surreal and disappointing. I grew up on Star Trek and somehow I just though we had (almost) arrived in a post-war, federation-like world. We know things should be solved with words because otherwise there are only losers. It’s how we raise our kids. I just keep thinking about how Jean Luc is looking down on us from orbit, slowly shaking his head whispering “Savages.”

In the Star Trek canon, world-war III starts in 2026: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Star_Trek#21st_cen...

We're pretty much on track for that.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#276

Post by DoingIsLearning » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

vegai_ wrote: post #160

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I ask, how are these economic restrictions affecting you in your daily life? Are people able to access money at their banks? Do you predict any future food security issues? Also in your opinion, what is the likely end game now for Putin? Putin is unlikely to win this war, Ukraine have been given near unlimited anti-tank weapons by the EU/US, and have air superiority now with extra MiG's donated by NATO and TB2 dr…

>gorilla warfare Sorry for being that guy but even though gorilla warfare would be genuinely horrifying, the term is actually guerrilla warfare. Which funnily enough can be translated as "warfare warfare".

Edited to avoid distracting from the argument.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#277

Post by danuker » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

wadim wrote: post #205

5ESS wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are sanctions going to make anybody more informed? They dont…That makes no sense. Instead of sanctions, a more effective strategy would be to provide Russians with free VPNs so that they can access western news media.

The same Russians who are currently using VPNs to post Russian propaganda all over reddit, facebook, twitter and co? If you think Russians are this way just because they don't have access to the guardian, then I have 20 years worth of Russian politics waiting for you. They don't care. They haven't cared when the wars in Chechnya or Georgia happened, they won't care now. The sanctions are supposed to force them to car…

Supposedly those can already read the news, so they would not be the target audience.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#278

Post by jimmydorry » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:01 AM UTC

hans_castorp wrote: post #164

namecheapTA wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should you really be on this site then? I'm sure there are non-US based tech/startup forums you can use, and not support an American based company from the evil American empire.

Well, there is a difference between reading a random news feed or using a service e.g. for communication where the US government can seize my data any time they want to.

What are you doing right now, if not communicating? HackewNews would be compelled to adhere to American laws.

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#279

Post by iso1631 » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:02 AM UTC

fabian2k wrote: post #161

godmode2019 wrote: post #155

I think its very sad normal Russian people are going to be targeted when European countries are still buying oil and gas from Russia 700million a day going straight to the war machine. Europeans pretend to care and sanction everything except for the oil and gas that is funding that war. There should always be a difference between government and people. All these sanctions are harming normal people, essentially econom…

It's simply not possible to change the infrastructure that fast. Gas is used for heating, that's not optional in winter. Europe needs to build more LNG terminals (which they decided to do) and order gas from other countries that have the ability to greatly increase their output. This all takes time, but in the long run Europe will stop being as dependen on Russian gas and oil as they are now, Putin made sure of that.

They've had nearly a decade

Re: Tell HN: If You Are in Russia

#280

Post by alephnan » Tue, Mar 01, 2022, 9:02 AM UTC

jd115 wrote: post #259

Here's my take on this, which you are not going to like one bit. It goes like this... The good people of Russia - and I'm not saying this with a tongue in cheek - the vast majority of the people of Russia truly are GOOD people, in the simplest, most sincere sense of the word... But they do need to go through some things. You just don't get to support a murderous communist regime for 100 years and then say "but we had…

> You just don't get to support a murderous communist regime for 100 years and then say "but we had nothing to do with it". I'm sorry, but you had everything to do with it.

This is easy to say when you have the privilege of living in a rich/developed country with free access to information and where you can increasingly voice your opinion without risking imprisonment or worst. Most people, especially in developing countries, are struggling to make ends meet and don't have time for ideology. The one that are very ideologically opposed and have done something about it have already sought asylum abroad.

The same argument can be made about America's multi century history of slavery, and only in recent decades have taken shape. People will wait for 50 acres and a mule in perpetuity