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The U.S. is now energy independent

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Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#71

Post by mulmen »

wolverine876 wrote: post #65
ctime wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually many places with real competition, near production and very little regulation in the U.S. did have $1.00 or so gallon gas, i.e. much of the south and near energy producing areas in LA for example. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that gas retailers in California would continue to price their gas at ~$5.00 a gallon when they don't actually have any to sell (or conversely, aren't selling any at all) because…

Which regulations are raising prices? Also, I'm a little confused: SD and LA are in California, of course.

“San Diego is even out-passing Hawaii, which is not even on the mainland.”

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#72

Post by landemva »

sp332 wrote: post #16
jimmygrapes wrote: post #2

This is a weird article. It is short and lacking detail, does not link any sources, and presents its data as if it's a first (it is not[0]). It reads, to be honest, as propaganda, especially considering the current rise in consumer prices for fuel and news about Saudi Arabia refusing to increase production[1]. What is the purpose of this article and why is it on the front page here? [0] https://www.eia.gov/energyexpl…

The data in the article agrees with your sources. It says there was a surplus in 2020, and that use and production have been pretty balanced since then.

Surplus in 2020 became deficit again in 2021. https://dailyenergyinsider.com/news/29194-united-states-expo...

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#73

Post by shibooya »

I think this is all best taken with a pinch of salt... if oil prices rise on geo-political tensions or on OPEC cutting supply, it tends to spike for all grades of oil to some degree. That implies that the price of shale will also spike - and hence you are not truly insulated from 'external' events even if you are self sufficient.

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#74

Post by landemva »

jmpman wrote: post #34

Can someone explain why during the start of Covid lockdowns, gasoline prices didn’t drop to $1.00/gallon? There was no demand, and plenty of supply. The simple supply/demand curve of my high school economics memory, seems to imply prices should have taken a dive to virtually zero. Sure they went down, but nowhere near what the models I’d learned would predict. Just a rant that lit up inside my brain every time I fill…

Pump price went slightly below $1/gallon where I was. Maybe you are in high tax State?

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#75

Post by gotoeleven »

wolverine876 wrote: post #65
ctime wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually many places with real competition, near production and very little regulation in the U.S. did have $1.00 or so gallon gas, i.e. much of the south and near energy producing areas in LA for example. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that gas retailers in California would continue to price their gas at ~$5.00 a gallon when they don't actually have any to sell (or conversely, aren't selling any at all) because…

Which regulations are raising prices? Also, I'm a little confused: SD and LA are in California, of course.

Gas tax is 51.1 cents/gal

They require a special formula for which there aren't many refineries https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/resources/fact-sheets/gasoline-freque...

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#76

Post by azinman2 »

staticautomatic wrote: post #70
8note wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no current threat of being priced out, the major oil producers are too busy trying to get market share on low cost oil. Going forward, will this ever be an issue? Peak oil is coming from societies moving away from oil and adopting renewables. By the time OPEC et Al start raising their prices, they will be irrelevant to most US consumers

Honest question: what about plastic and other non-fuel uses?

I’d love to see a point where drop in oil consumption means plastic becomes expensive, and instead we can finally find better alternatives that don’t harm the planet and people so much.

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#77

Post by landemva »

chiefalchemist wrote: post #13

> The impact on geopolitics extends to a potential Russian invasion of Ukraine. Disruptions to European energy supplies would have a less direct effect on the U.S. than they might have in an earlier era. Put another way, the USA now has less incentive to "keep the peace." Putin's drama and posturing, plus the USA being untethered...that's not a good combination.

USA should leave peace keeping and war mongering with Russia to the Europeans who live there and who seem to want to import Russian energy. USA can withdraw from NATO and spend that tax money at home.

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#78

Post by wolverine876 »

gotoeleven wrote: post #75
wolverine876 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which regulations are raising prices? Also, I'm a little confused: SD and LA are in California, of course.

Gas tax is 51.1 cents/gal They require a special formula for which there aren't many refineries https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/resources/fact-sheets/gasoline-freque...

Thanks, but tax isn't a regulation and doesn't have the impacts described in the GP.

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#79

Post by danielmarkbruce »

wolverine876 wrote: post #66
danielmarkbruce wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was made this way by the folks who figured out how to do fracking. Politics had little to do with it. https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=PET&s=M...

It was the American public: Fracking was developed in a federal government research program in the early 1980s, IIRC.

Yep, lots of people involved. It wasn't being done economically at large scale until 2000 something though. I think the very first things considered fracking were done before the 80's, and various companies/people made improvements along the way...

Re: The U.S. is now energy independent

#80

Post by Scoundreller »

philipkglass wrote: post #37
XorNot wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better argument would be whether there are any restrictions at all that, during a world shortage, would prevent companies producing oil from exporting it to other parts of the world to the detriment of local US consumers. There aren't, so the US isn't independent on anything: the regular citizen will get priced out of the market regardless of their need the moment there's profit to be made elsewhere.

The United States banned crude oil exports from the 1970s until 2015: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_Policy_and_Conservation... https://ballotpedia.org/Crude_oil_export_ban It didn't seem to affect retail fuel prices very much either way.

The impact wasn’t what you thought: it turned the US into the biggest exporter of refined products.

In other words, refining security/oversaturation.

A lot of neighbouring countries basically got the US to refine oil at a discount because it was the only way to get excess oil out.

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