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Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

nature.com

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Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#331

Post by hahajk »

px43 wrote: post #259
habibur wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bad news is that heart muscle doesn't rebuild, like how our body muscles do. But a doctor can ensure how much of our fear is right.

Funny enough, one of the original MRNA treatments developed my Moderna was something that would temporarily activate stem cell generation around heart tissue. Sounds like in testing, the mice that got the treatment after having a heart attack were much less likely to have subsequent heart attacks. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4-DMKNT7xI

I was going to ask if anyone knew how they found mice for these studies. Do they choose mice they have on hand that naturally have had heart attacks? Would those mice be involved in other studies too?

But I ended up googling it and sort of wish I didn’t ask the question.

https://www.theawl.com/2016/04/if-you-give-a-mouse-a-heart-a...

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#332

Post by Ambolia »

f6v wrote: post #310
Ambolia wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I think if you apply a medical treatment approved on emergency grounds to most of the population it would be a good idea to track their health and raise an alarm if something changes, or "correlates" as you say. Maybe even have control groups just in case. But maybe that's just me being unreasonable.

I think these vaccines are already held to an incredibly high standard. AZ use was put on hold here in Europe after just couple cases of blood clotting. Same for Moderna when there’s been the cases of heart issues.

Allegedly, the AZ issues may have been political as much as scientific:

* https://www.forbes.com/sites/leahrosenbaum/2021/03/15/politi...

** https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/mar/26/how-the-ast...

*** https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/world/europe/europe-astra...

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#333

Post by rsfern »

postsantum wrote: post #312
girvo wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your “opinion” is contrary to observable facts and puts others in danger, yes. Pretty straightforward actually. Those posting this nonsense ignore the facts, so ignoring them seems prudent.

>observable facts >FDA says it needs 75 years to release Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine data to the public

This should be part of our discourse going forward about transparency in clinical trials, but you do not need to rely on this data to make a rational decision to take the vaccine. There is loads of evidence from many different countries now, and there is enough granular evidence to weigh the potential downsides as well (i.e. take the lower dose mRNA if you’re young)

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#334

Post by smhg »

thejosh wrote: post #153
jmpman wrote: post #139

New Zealand has been basically isolated and Covid free for the past year. Their population is approaching 95% vaccinated. It would be interesting to see statistics on heart disease rates in their population over the past year, as we could then be certain any increase is vaccine related and not Covid related.

Western Australia has half the population of NZ and has been mostly covid free as well (until we decided to open the borders).

Would you mind to be more specific? What do you mean by 'until open borders'? Air and/or sea? How were domestic and international related infections different? Were containment measures different for both?

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#335

Post by Ambolia »

sumosudo wrote: post #279
Ambolia wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would have been interesting to have control groups in every country that did a vaccine rollout. But I guess we will never know now.

well luckily there exists a control continent. Africa doesn't trust the western medicine cabal, so we'll see in due time whats going on

Not sure if it is a good control group. How much was the flu or other coronaviruses a thing in Africa before Covid? They may be climatic or other factors that make Covid irrelevant there.

If you want a control group I'd assume it's always better if it's randomized and similar to the non-control group.

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#336

Post by CipherThrowaway »

NullInvictus wrote: post #192

Every COVID story here is an interesting little glimpse into how a seemingly normal forum has their latent political views exploited into adopting a conspiracy theory, re: anti-vaccine rhetoric. It becomes a little more extreme every day. This study has nothing to do with the vaccine, and yet this is what HN clamors for. I wonder how many people here understand what kind of ride they're being taken for.

Honestly I do not find it surprising. I've seen it called "engineer's disease": the tendency of engineers to believe that expertise in their technical field gives them a superior insight into other technical fields. Or that their research and systematization habits transfer to other fields where they readily yield greater insight than direct experience.

This way of thinking really feels rampant in our field. I've seen developers read a Wikipedia page or blog post and suddenly think they know better than mathematicians, lawyers, doctors, research scientists, economists, ethicists etc. No topic is too niche or trivial to be safe from this effect. A little while ago the topic of Geometric Algebra swept through HN and engineers with no math theory background were posting sensationalist takes about how GA was destined to supersede the orthodoxy.

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#337

Post by postsantum »

rsfern wrote: post #333
postsantum wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>observable facts >FDA says it needs 75 years to release Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine data to the public

This should be part of our discourse going forward about transparency in clinical trials, but you do not need to rely on this data to make a rational decision to take the vaccine. There is loads of evidence from many different countries now, and there is enough granular evidence to weigh the potential downsides as well (i.e. take the lower dose mRNA if you’re young)

Can people make a rational decision of balancing out their personal risks then? For a young and healthy person there is little upside in taking a dose of mRNA

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#338

Post by antocv »

nodamage wrote: post #298
dijit wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is actually the best reason to have people remain unvaccinated, and to not strictly mandate vaccines. I'm pro-vax (god, why do I have to say that?) but what's seriously pissed me off about this whole COVID thing is how quickly it became political. At the beginning there was a real sense of "we're in this together" but now you can be pretty certain of someones political affiliation if they choose not to wear a ma…

> So why do you need to have a vaccine pass to go places? You can still carry the virus and infect people. Even if they aren't 100% effective, vaccines still reduce both the likelihood that you will become infected and also the likelihood that you will transmit the virus to others.

No post body was provided.

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#339

Post by tim333 »

rightbyte wrote: post #307
GuB-42 wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only study that I've seen compare Covid-19 to the flu is one related to long-covid. You can have long-covid-like symptoms after the flu, but it is about twice more likely with Covid-19 than with the flu. https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/jo... I guess there are others, I just didn't randomly stumbled across them.

That is depressing to read. Wont Covid19 cannibalize on other coronaviruses' "market share"?

It's taken most of flu's market share the last couple of years. On the plus side it may spur us to improve air quality like we improved water quality a century or two ago.

Re: Heart-disease risk soars after Covid, even with a mild case

#340

Post by jhugo »

parineum wrote: post #128
laurent92 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lockdowns have also broken everyone’s regular exercise and healthy habits. On charts we all assign this to Covid, but lockdowns were an artificial, additional decision.

Presumably they are using non-infected people as a control.

Unfortunately they didn't perform any tests to verify that the control group had not had COVID (it's in the article).
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