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Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
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Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#82> In quiet, polite voices, Aysu and Lütfullah Kuçar describe the nearly 20 months they spent in state boarding schools in China's western region of Xinjiang, forcibly separated from their family. > Under the watchful gaze of their father, the two ethnically Uyghur children say that their heads were shaved and that class monitors and teachers frequently hit them, locked them in dark rooms and forced them to hold stres…
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Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
If we hold the United States to account, then how far back should that go? Prior to the U.S. government, smallpox was aggressively dispersed in the Americas, removing 90% of the native population. Are we willing to indict Spain? If not, why not? I am no more guilty than they. (I have karma to burn, feel free.)
The only thing we can change to actually help people is not through indictment of past but by ensuring that abuses stop and abusers change behavior. It's good that some places have stopped it now. it's not good that some are still continuing to do so - and need to be stopped. Past abuses do not excuse or justify current ones, they are in an entirely different moral category that things which are happening now and can…
What you have not understood is that the U.S. is the oldest functioning democracrcy.
Our age implies intransigence.
We're like your obnoxious uncle.
Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#84I talked about this recently, and I was reminded of the Blackhawk War. I have read Blackhawk's memoirs, because it's such a part of my community, but nobody knows it. There were extenuating circumstances (the British gun-running down the Mississipi). U.S. forces suffered important defeats (Campbell's Island, and the Battle of Credit Island that humbled future president Zachary Taylor.) I learned from another source t…
You read about horrible things that happened in the 1800s and your takeaway is... we should allow such things to happen again today? Can you elaborate a little bit?
> You read about horrible things that happened in the 1800s and your takeaway is... we should allow such things to happen again today? Can you elaborate a little bit?
Despite all that, or maybe thanks to having recognized the errors in our ways, we have grown into a democracy that now truly respect cultural differences.
Look at free speech here in the US, vs say in Austria or Germany: after WW2, they banned everything nazi related. We have some crazies marching down in full uniforms. Yet they are the one with a neonazi problem- not us. How come?
What is happening is sad and horrible, but at the society level, these are growing pains. You can't force enlightenment onto societies by force.
Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can we possibly see ourselves as objective judges when our collective history is essentially, from this historic perspective, butchery? What blessed this generation with a wisdom not seen before? What, precisely?
Seriously? You see reports of state-sponsored child abuse and your first instinct is, "well, who are we to judge?" I imagine the answer should be, "pretty much anyone who isn't a child abuser."
> You see reports of state-sponsored child abuse
Yaa, I heard they're locking kids up in cages, leaving them exposed to Covid.
Oh no, that is what the US is doing to Mexican kids.
Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#86Earlier quoted context omitted.
You read about horrible things that happened in the 1800s and your takeaway is... we should allow such things to happen again today? Can you elaborate a little bit?
Pepper spraying Standing Rock Indians who don't want an oil pipeline going through their reservation and burn up the planet to make some American heir richer was in the 1800s? It was about 5 years ago.
I encourage you to understand the full and true history behind this event:
Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#87Can anyone point to a change or sacrifice they have made because they disagree with Chinas treatment of anyone?
1. I always check the country of origin before buying. I still buy China-made products when there's absolutely no other option, but whenever there's an alternative made anywhere outside China (whether higher priced, or even slightly inferior), I buy that instead. 2. Going to fund the development (since I can't do this myself) of a browser plugin to help people find non-China goods on Amazon easily. Just two features:…
Happy to read so many others here are doing #1. The country of origin for where a product was made is a great way to stop funneling your money to China.
I've managed to spread this habit to a few of friends of mine but for the most part most don't seem to care. Often the reason being it's just cheaper to buy Chinese made.
Human greed knows no bounds. Most people seem happy to put their head in the sand. I feel with time this type of movement can grow stronger though.
Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Seriously? You see reports of state-sponsored child abuse and your first instinct is, "well, who are we to judge?" I imagine the answer should be, "pretty much anyone who isn't a child abuser."
Sovereignty means many things, but one thing specifically: No other realm may decide the fate of these people. China is sovereign, and we must acknowledge that.
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Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why can't one acknowledge that their country did horrible things in the past and at the same time demand that other countries don't repeat history? You are not born with inherited sympathy for every action that your ancestors did in the past.
Nixon opened the door to China in 1972. Just imagine if free and fair trade hadn't happen in the U.S. in 1776. What would we be, in 1972? I shudder to think.
I'm sorry, but I fail to see the connection of this to the question I was asking
Re: Uyghur kids detail abuse at China's boarding schools in Xinjiang
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
Seriously? You see reports of state-sponsored child abuse and your first instinct is, "well, who are we to judge?" I imagine the answer should be, "pretty much anyone who isn't a child abuser."
Sovereignty means many things, but one thing specifically: No other realm may decide the fate of these people. China is sovereign, and we must acknowledge that.
I'm not sure I understand your point. The RPC's sovereignty over the region is enabling them to take these actions, but that doesn't mean we must like, enable, or respect these actions, or let them pass without comment.