Earlier quoted context omitted.
Financial analysts != energy technologists with a scientific background. Its small money on a broad industry bet thats all in an economy with very few quality investments available. Don't read too much into it.
So you think it's in GS's best interest to make uninformed decisions on a continual basis? Seriously?
Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
271–280 of 325 posts
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#272Earlier quoted context omitted.
Financial analysts != energy technologists with a scientific background. Its small money on a broad industry bet thats all in an economy with very few quality investments available. Don't read too much into it.
So you think it's in GS's best interest to make uninformed decisions on a continual basis? Seriously?
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#273Earlier quoted context omitted.
They aren't really the same types of systems. Pneumatic "muscle pressure" is common in lots of industrial applications, especially those that operate in austere environments. But those are different than the tech being researched in the article in large part because the mechanical compressors in industrial applications are hugely inefficient. Many constant volume compressors have 90%+ of the energy as waste heat. I b…
How does this work? How can you compress air without raising the pressure? Are you sure you don't mean adiabatic?
Hydrostor has a thermal management system that captures the heat and stores is during compression. Then it reuses the heat when it is decompressing the air.[1]
This seem extremely promising as a much smaller footprint solution than pumped storage and much more sustainable and lower cost than any other energy storage solution. I just heard about them today, and I'm extremely impressed.
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#274In early 20th century in London there was an alternative hydraulic "power grid" with plants (aka pumps), storages and an underground distribution network of pipes. A building, for example, could connect to high pressure water mains and use it to power elevators. Electricity eventually won, but it's interesting to see an idea coming back. Zeppelins next! [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Hydraulic_Power_Company
The Amish use compressed air: http://www.amishfamilyvalues.com/amish/amish-electricity/
"This was a crisis. Without electricity, the Amish couldn’t store milk, and the church was adamant that Amish were not going connect to the local electric company. Finally a solution was found. It was decided that diesel generators could be used to power the refrigerators. This decision allowed the Amish to continue their tradition as dairy farmers without having to use public electricity."
So the Amish are allowed to use electricity, just not from the public grid? Generators seem like a weird loophole to their own rules.
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#275In early 20th century in London there was an alternative hydraulic "power grid" with plants (aka pumps), storages and an underground distribution network of pipes. A building, for example, could connect to high pressure water mains and use it to power elevators. Electricity eventually won, but it's interesting to see an idea coming back. Zeppelins next! [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Hydraulic_Power_Company
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#276Earlier quoted context omitted.
The Amish use compressed air: http://www.amishfamilyvalues.com/amish/amish-electricity/
This is interesting: "This was a crisis. Without electricity, the Amish couldn’t store milk, and the church was adamant that Amish were not going connect to the local electric company. Finally a solution was found. It was decided that diesel generators could be used to power the refrigerators. This decision allowed the Amish to continue their tradition as dairy farmers without having to use public electricity." So th…
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#277Earlier quoted context omitted.
This sort of system is used today in many modern industrial facilities. Case in point: Amazon warehouses. Lots of the mechanical automations inside some of those warehouses are powered by compressed air in open loop systems. As the conveyor pushes the item off, onto a different lane, there's a distinct hiss of air escaping. The movement of the machine was powered by compressed air. Out in the parking lot in these fac…
The common term is "pneumatics" and the components are prevalent in all automation and manufacturing. The air required is typically compressed on site. Pneumatic actuators are relatively inexpensive, have a binary state that is easy to control, and offer a high power density.
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#278Earlier quoted context omitted.
I read an article in a woodworking magazine about how one Amish woodworking shop was built to avoid using electricity. The whole shop ran off a stationary diesel engine driving a shaft in a floor trench and belt drove the larger stationary machinery like band saws, table saws, planers, drill presses, joiners and so on. But what about hand tools? A large belt driven air compressor off the diesel engine handled a myria…
This is basically how most indistrial setups was before engines and motors became a commodity. You had water wheels as your main power source, from which other tools was driven via belts and gears. Later the waterwheel was replaced by an electric motor or a fuel powered engine - but still built around just one source of power, with elaborate setups to drive different tools. With the added benefits you could build fac…
The Edison museum in Orange NJ also has such a preserved shop setup but electric driven by one or two big motors on an elevated platform.
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#279I knew Danielle Fong from Lightsail Energy, folded in 2016, and at that time compressed air seemed like a great solution especially for LatAm that needed robust low cost batteries for critical infrastructure (like hospitals) on an unreliable power grid. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danielle_Fong Would be great to see this technology reach maturity!
She's on HN, curious what her thoughts are: https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=DaniFong
Re: Goldman Sachs invests $250M in compressed air energy storage
#280Earlier quoted context omitted.
The Amish use compressed air: http://www.amishfamilyvalues.com/amish/amish-electricity/
This is interesting: "This was a crisis. Without electricity, the Amish couldn’t store milk, and the church was adamant that Amish were not going connect to the local electric company. Finally a solution was found. It was decided that diesel generators could be used to power the refrigerators. This decision allowed the Amish to continue their tradition as dairy farmers without having to use public electricity." So th…
https://www.npr.org/2019/05/13/721551785/a-fishing-line-enci...