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Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

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Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#261

Post by dclowd9901 »

pdimitar wrote: post #216
jaarse wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think of it like any other type of medicine. I have blood pressure issues. I try to eat right, and exercise. I have my whole life. I practice meditation and slowing down and generally feel fairly stress free as well. I do this to address the “root” cause as you would put it. Unfortunately in this area I also need a little help from modern science, so I’m glad I have access to it.

I think of it exactly like you said. Apparently my root comment was worded in a way that people thought I'm sitting on an extreme. I really am not though.

Your initial argument sits pretty squarely in a camp or class of person that dismisses medication for mental illness. If you meant mental health medications have been overprescribed I think I even take issue with that. Anyone who’s been in that world and has been on any kind of mental health medication knows it’s not usually the first pitch thrown by mental health professionals.

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#262

Post by simmerup »

honkycat wrote: post #201
pdimitar wrote: post #102

I'll join the chorus of the other sibling commenters here by expressing skepticism that any medication will at all help with anything. Psychiatric medication often simply numbs your brain so it stops being worried about things that legitimately and truly torment it. It reduces your sensitivity, it knocks off your normal brain chemicals balance, and it turns you into a robot. I've had a family member go through this a…

Quoted post unavailable.

> I think this a very evil, ignorant comment. Sincerely: You should be ashamed of yourself for posting this.

I suspect we would all be better off if we were kinder to each other and assumed the best rather than judges each other in this way.

Before the internet I doubt most people would be called ‘evil’ in their lives, now it’s almost punctuation.

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#263

Post by aogaili »

pdimitar wrote: post #165
aogaili wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of medication is not to always numb your brain but temporary ease the pain until you can stand on your own feet again. When life goes so wrong for some people and their brain pain signal is so high that you can't even get out of bed, those medications help. It helps them to sleep and think less until they start to think correctly. The issue today, is that people are expected to be productive all the time de…

I am not arguing with the desired outcome. But what I've seen more often than not is that people get addicted to the pills and never do stand on their own feet again. And I agree with your second paragraph completely. I am sick of society pretending that people are "sick". They are not. They are responding naturally to an increasingly hostile world.

I'd agree with you here, there is a tendency to overprescribe, and I think depression is showing a natural response to unhealthy and difficult condition (perceived or actual). Are they "sick"? well technically yes, just like one could have a flu and can't work. I think a better analogy would be injury, it is as if the mind is injured, kind like a broken leg that you can't walk on.

Psychiatrist and family member tend to fear relapses, and typically the effort required to enhance the situation is tremendous, and some situations are simply not fixable, they need to be accepted, time need to pass for healing, and attention need to be shifted elsewhere. The person would certainly lose some confidence in their own ability to withstand future pressures and tend to fear relapses as well, and yes there are financial incentives to sell pills and pitch as an easy fix. Thus, there is a risk of being dependant on the pills.

However, a good treatment plan is a mix of medicine and some form of talk/behavioural therapy. The medicine is designed to be temporary but might be necessary fix (unless there is a real hardware issue which I think is a rarity), and is usually combined with CTB and other form of talk/behavioural therapy aiming to strengthen healthy coping skills, eliminate damaging thoughts, change perception and take some actions. Do some people need medicine for lifetime? I don't know personally, but I've a feeling it is being overprescribed and it might cause more harm than good if taking for a long time. I mean, who knows what it does to the brain reward system if used long-term? I don't think it is well understood.

Ideally, people are given the time/care to heal on their own, around 3 to 6 months at least for severe depression and usually the person emerges at the other end have different perspective/interests in life. But the problem is the economical system is setup for constant productivity and 6 months of downtime for many of us is simply not an option.

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#264

Post by DyslexicAtheist »

The research paper[1] in the Lancet from Feb. 2020, on the psychological effects of quarantine predicted this.

I think while the first quarantine / lock-down could not be avoided, the current situation could be avoided if we were able to battle the misinformation and reach 90% vaccination in every country.

This pandemic is more severe than it has to be because it's also a mental health crisis. The people engaging in anti-vaxx conspiracies sound out of touch and deluded, but I think this is their way to cope. (believing in magic, wishful thinking, denial, are all pretty common with disease/health issues or in the face of uncertainty). Like an ostrich sticking their head into the sand it's probably how they deal with many other challenges in life too.

Question really is how to go forward. Those who say "let it rip" might have an agenda to kill as many people as possible on the planet (out of spite but probably because they're themselves deeply depressed or isolated).

One proposal that many hate but could stop the pandemic is to allow exception for certain cases prescribed by a doctor, but for everybody else vaccination has to be mandatory. We did it with measles and smallpox, so why not with covid?

______

[1]

Summary:

We did a Review of the psychological impact of quarantine using three electronic databases. Of 3166 papers found, 24 are included in this Review. Most reviewed studies reported negative psychological effects including post-traumatic stress symptoms, confusion, and anger. Stressors included longer quarantine duration, infection fears, frustration, boredom, inadequate supplies, inadequate information, financial loss, and stigma. Some researchers have suggested long-lasting effects. In situations where quarantine is deemed necessary, officials should quarantine individuals for no longer than required, provide clear rationale for quarantine and information about protocols, and ensure sufficient supplies are provided. Appeals to altruism by reminding the public about the benefits of quarantine to wider society can be favourable.

"The psychological impact of quarantine and how to reduce it: rapid review of the evidence" https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#265

Post by janeroe »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #105
fny wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no evidence society would have collapsed. Many countries do not have the health infrastructure the US has and have not undergone societal collapse. Yes more elderly would have died. More people with comorbities would have died. But societal collapse? The shutdown lasted for far too long. Mock Florida all you want, but they weathered the pandemic far better than many states with strict lockdown regimes (Calif…

Why do you assume I am referring to the US? Maybe for you it's normal for there to be looting and rampant crime in the face of crisis or emergency scenarios but I don't think that speaks for the rest of the world. > Many countries do not have the health infrastructure the US has and have not undergone societal collapse. What does this mean? We have universal healthcare and in my city emergency services are so overwhe…

> We have universal healthcare and in my city emergency services are so overwhelmed and overworked the wait time for the past day is over an hour.

That tells more about your healthcare system than about anything else. My city had virtually no lockdowns (but 2 weeks at the beginning until the measure became really unpopular), nobody ever cared about distancing or masking, the vaccination rates are low as hell, schools and businesses work as usual and yet here we are safe and sound. No societal collapse you promise, no mass extinction, nothing. Some people in their 80s died which is a tragedy since that had never happened before (aren't people supposed to live forever). But other than that, life as usual. What are we doing wrong?

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#266

Post by dclowd9901 »

fny wrote: post #12
KiranRao0 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Collective behavior in response to COVID was a life transfer from the youth to the elderly.

Both are true. Fiscal and monetary stimulus drove financial assets owned mostly by 40+ and retirees to the moon. House prices have become more unaffordable just as millennials (already saddled with college debt) are getting ready to buy their first homes. Inflation has eaten into real wages even with increases. We also locked up an entire generation of zoomers in a house for two years. I was all for lockdowns in earl…

Honestly, blame the far left. This was their totem and they’ve been staunch about it. I consider myself a democratic socialist, but planting the flag of progressives into the dirt at the line of perpetual lockdowns was a _huge_ and likely catastrophic misstep, both politically and (more importantly) societally.

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#267

Post by vmception »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #186
SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a reason long distance relationships fail ??? “ Research has even shown that long distance couples tend to have the same or more satisfaction in their relationships than couples who are geographically close, and higher levels of dedication to their relationships and less feelings of being trapped.” https://time.com/5316307/best-long-distance-relationship-tip...

Survivorship bias. Most fail quickly, the only ones that make it are the super dedicated couples.

All kinds of relationships fail quickly.

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#268

Post by paganel »

throwawayboise wrote: post #29
scop wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve pondered this on occasion. In this era of people in their 80s holding many of the major positions in government and business in the US, I wonder whether this was their final attempt to prevent transferring power onto the newer generations. I’m not saying this was a conscious strategy, but it certainly was a very interesting phenomenon especially after listening to Eric Weinstein decry the lack of generational tr…

There should be a mandatory retirement age for government. 65 sounds about right.

They kind of have that in China for public officials, if I'm not mistaken, and it's a big thing that Xi is the first of their leaders in a long time who seems to ignore it. On further research it's a rule imposed back in 2002 [1]:

> In 2002, then-President Jiang Zemin tried to clear the ranks at the top of the party by instituting retirement age limits: 68 for top leaders and 65 for senior level officials. That rule has been followed with varying degrees of success. Mr Jiang himself delayed his own retirement. He stayed on as the chairman of China's military for two years until 2004 after relinquishing his other positions to his successor, Hu Jintao.

[1] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-21783353

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#269

Post by dclowd9901 »

laurent92 wrote: post #227
ralph84 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. Airline pilots are forced to retire at 65 and their decisions only affect a few hundred people. Politicians' decisions affect millions.

I’d rather be governed by people who have 65 years of experience with life, than by people who snort coke at 40 to be the shark they’ve always wanted. Politicians never seem to take correct decisions anyway.

Really? I feel exactly the opposite. I wouldn’t trust someone over 65 to drive me to the store.

Re: Youth suicide attempts soared during pandemic, CDC report says

#270

Post by vmception »

SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #66
fny wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a classic HN response. Humans are social creatures. How are lockdowns and social distancing not causal? There's a reason long distance relationships fail and solitary confinement is an ultimate punishment. Add to this doomsday news on loop, confusing messaging on vaccines. I also have too, too much anecdata to counter this. I spent time helping families during the COVID crisis. The amount of confusion and uncert…

> There's a reason long distance relationships fail ??? “ Research has even shown that long distance couples tend to have the same or more satisfaction in their relationships than couples who are geographically close, and higher levels of dedication to their relationships and less feelings of being trapped.” https://time.com/5316307/best-long-distance-relationship-tip...

I was looking at a variety of discussions on age-gapped relationships and have noticed the same, people blame the relationship failing on the age gap and the younger persons own admissions about how they look at it differently, instead of the general distribution of all relationships failing

People basically get what they want tk hear out of it, instead of checking whether the same standard yields different results elsewhere

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