Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising • Hacker News Board

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#41

Post by sam_lowry_ » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:21 PM UTC

mlindner wrote: post #36

snickerer wrote: post #22

I traveled many post-Soviet countries in the past years with my old camping car. My personal impressions in Kazakhstan were frightening. A deeply corrupt state, much worse than Russia. Aggressive armed bandits in police uniform tried to rob me several times. Kazakhstan is true mafia state where every part of the regime tries to enrich itself at the expanse of the people. In contrast to the rich oil elite there are th…

"Backed by the west" is a common conspiracy theory pushed by Russian government. You should be asking yourself who's benefiting. The west does not benefit from anything related to those states, all oil they produce first flows through Russia. Russia benefits by having these states as basically feudal subservient states that they can extort for profit. (I will note that most western oil comes from the middle east with…

Kazakh elite keeps its money in western banks, flies western planes to western capitals and owns land and property in top western locations. Same for Russian elite.

In the Cold War, dealing with Soviets was unthinkable. Now, the West is complacent, there is even a term for it, Schröderizatsiya. See this opinion piece by the former Estonian president [1].

[1] https://news.err.ee/1608362130/toomas-hendrik-ilves-alexei-n...

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#42

Post by ralmidani » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:21 PM UTC

wheelerof4te wrote: post #38

ralmidani wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ISIS (and Al-Qaeda) are predictable, convenient excuses for keeping dictatorships in the Muslim world. Before ISIS took over Raqqah and other territory in Syria and Iraq, it was the FSA (Free Syrian Army), not Assad, who kicked ISIS out of Aleppo and the Damascus countryside. When Putin intervened in 2015, the overwhelming majority of airstrikes targeted the FSA and civilian areas outside the control of both Assad an…

Here's a hint: Stop causing color revolutions in other coutries, that in turn create a power vacuum, which leads to chaos and anarchy. Seriously, that is not hard. What makes you think FSA are "moderate" headchopers and how are they any better than Assad? Just because they have "Free" in the name? Such naive thinking.

Aside from the ISIS excuse, the other tired cliche is that it’s all a US conspiracy. Addressed in another comment here:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29822573

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#43

Post by mlindner » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:22 PM UTC

Lots of weird extremely Russian-patriot sounding comments in this thread. Russia is sending paratroopers because they don't want another Ukraine situation. They don't want Kazakhstan to break away from Russia because of a popular uprising like Ukraine did. And it's a lot easier for them to prevent it than it was for Ukraine because Ukraine doesn't border Europe so the west won't protest it as much. I expect a whole lot of bloodshed is about to happen and I'm not looking forward to it. Best of luck to the Khazak populace.

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#44

Post by mlindner » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:25 PM UTC

sam_lowry_ wrote: post #41

mlindner wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Backed by the west" is a common conspiracy theory pushed by Russian government. You should be asking yourself who's benefiting. The west does not benefit from anything related to those states, all oil they produce first flows through Russia. Russia benefits by having these states as basically feudal subservient states that they can extort for profit. (I will note that most western oil comes from the middle east with…

Kazakh elite keeps its money in western banks, flies western planes to western capitals and owns land and property in top western locations. Same for Russian elite. In the Cold War, dealing with Soviets was unthinkable. Now, the West is complacent, there is even a term for it, Schröderizatsiya. See this opinion piece by the former Estonian president [1]. [1] https://news.err.ee/1608362130/toomas-hendrik-ilves-alexei-…

> Kazakh elite keeps its money in western banks, flies western planes to western capitals and owns land and property in top western locations. Same for Russian elite.

So does the Russian elite as you say, even Putin himself. The US's currency is the reserve currency of the world and the currency most commerce is done in so western banks are used. They also are much more stable than banks in their own countries where other elites could steal their money. This doesn't mean that the US or the west is somehow controlling their countries.

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#45

Post by wheelerof4te » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:27 PM UTC

ralmidani wrote: post #35

throwaway4good wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, given the US-Russia conflict over Ukraine, this conflict is awfully well-timed for the US.

Not everything in life is a conspiracy, and people often rebel spontaneously against their government. Not every revolution in a country ruled by Putin and Pals is waiting for The White House to give the green light. Also, did the US tell the regime in Kazakhstan to raise oil prices? That was, obviously, not the people’s only grievance, but it was the spark that lead to the protests and rebellion. The “US meddling” e…

Pray tell, what exactly happened on 6th of January outside the Capitol? Why some people are allowed to fight corruption, but others aren't?

Isn't the US lobiying another word for corruption?

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#46

Post by mlindner » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:27 PM UTC

radmuzom wrote: post #21

Quoted post unavailable.

Russia's sending paratroopers and it's somehow the US interfering? Lol? Khazakistan is under Russia's wing. Russia props up the dictatorship to help Russia. This uprising is a popular uprising.

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#47

Post by pjc50 » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:28 PM UTC

snickerer wrote: post #22

I traveled many post-Soviet countries in the past years with my old camping car. My personal impressions in Kazakhstan were frightening. A deeply corrupt state, much worse than Russia. Aggressive armed bandits in police uniform tried to rob me several times. Kazakhstan is true mafia state where every part of the regime tries to enrich itself at the expanse of the people. In contrast to the rich oil elite there are th…

> But why is such a dysfunctional dictatorship so stable? Why did it last for three decades?

Ceaușescu went from addressing a mass crowd in the square to execution in five days after ruling for about 25 years. Dictatorships are like steam boilers: so long as the pressure is contained, everything looks fine, until suddenly it isn't.

(Interestingly having looked him up https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolae_Ceau%C8%99escu he's one of the few leaders to have achieved what is now denounced as "neoliberal", the paying down of the country's national debt. It only took starving the country to do it.)

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#48

Post by keewee7 » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:28 PM UTC

yread wrote: post #20

Just a few months ago it looked different, there were articles like this https://globalcomment.com/is-russia-losing-or-tightening-its... about US looking into getting an airbase and Tokayev trying to play it both sides. That probably won't happen anymore

Look what happened to Armenia that tried to appease both Russia and the West.

It's more important to have few close allies than appeasing everyone.

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#49

Post by sausageman » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:29 PM UTC

mlindner wrote: post #36

snickerer wrote: post #22

I traveled many post-Soviet countries in the past years with my old camping car. My personal impressions in Kazakhstan were frightening. A deeply corrupt state, much worse than Russia. Aggressive armed bandits in police uniform tried to rob me several times. Kazakhstan is true mafia state where every part of the regime tries to enrich itself at the expanse of the people. In contrast to the rich oil elite there are th…

"Backed by the west" is a common conspiracy theory pushed by Russian government. You should be asking yourself who's benefiting. The west does not benefit from anything related to those states, all oil they produce first flows through Russia. Russia benefits by having these states as basically feudal subservient states that they can extort for profit. (I will note that most western oil comes from the middle east with…

I went to school with a young kazak person I don't want to reveal to much about them, but let me just say this. Their parents had direct contact to the state and they were unaccountably rich went to an insanely expensive private school and owned various apartments all across Europe. The west DOES benefit from the corruption related to those states.

Re: Russia sends troops to Kazakhstan to put down deadly uprising

#50

Post by mlindner » Thu, Jan 06, 2022, 12:29 PM UTC

throwaway4good wrote: post #17

boppo1 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>foreign interests I think he meant the US

Well, given the US-Russia conflict over Ukraine, this conflict is awfully well-timed for the US.

There isn't a US-Russia conflict over Ukraine. US had no part of Ukraine's uprising. Late in the Trump presidency long after issues had settled, the US started getting involved with selling supplies.