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Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

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Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#321

Post by krig »

DanElectrode wrote: post #302
krig wrote: post #253

I don't understand how there can be so many posts here defending this UI. Is this a concerted effort by Microsoft to flood hacker news with their viewpoint? I just don't see how this is a defensible UI, at all. Seriously, it's overwhelming. The UI is constantly shouting commands at the user, regardless of what the user is trying to do. UIs like these are exactly where the problem my parents have with computers come f…

The new Windows 8 tile-based interface will be the default way to interact with your files and applications, Explorer will be only for when you need to do some advanced file management. Your parents will most likely never have to use it.

No one should have to use it.

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#322

Post by doublesprout »

sunchild wrote: post #66
51Cards wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but people don't WANT to learn things like this. My mother doesn't want to remember what mouse button to click or that CTRL or ALT is a modifier on this command. I would argue that THIS is what made Apple's OS hang on all those years it was in the severe minority. There is a segment of the population that wants only one mouse button to click, not 3, not 3 plus CTRL or ALT or etc. Apple did end up having to rely h…

This doesn't explain the "invert selection" button. I'm pretty sure that one is indefensible.

It's not immediately obvious from the label what the button does, but it is from experimentation. And unlike the multistep 'cut' or 'paste' buttons or 'move to' (which pops up a dialog, I think?), the discovery process for a user is one click.

Or maybe two. One to go from selected file to all other files, and another click to get back.

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#323

Post by sid0 »

sunchild wrote: post #188
sid0 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what type of "documents" you're referring to Aha, therein lies the rub. These documents could be essentially arbitrary files, and there's no substitute to a general purpose file manager for them. Writing an app for every single file format that could be present on the USB drive is highly inefficient compared to the usual file manager. My basic point is that filesystems are a well-established standard , a…

If the file type is arbitrary, and doesn't correspond to an app, then you're using your internal hard disk as a file store. There are better solutions for that.

Such as?

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#324

Post by sid0 »

jad wrote: post #215
sid0 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what type of "documents" you're referring to Aha, therein lies the rub. These documents could be essentially arbitrary files, and there's no substitute to a general purpose file manager for them. Writing an app for every single file format that could be present on the USB drive is highly inefficient compared to the usual file manager. My basic point is that filesystems are a well-established standard , a…

You're missing the point. iOS devices have file systems. The simple fact is that people just don't understand them very well. Most normal users just put everything on their desktop because it's the only way they can ever find them again. Maybe you can provide a practical example of a case where you need to move files onto your system that can't be opened by any of the applications installed on your system. I can't th…

Maybe you can provide a practical example of a case where you need to move files onto your system that can't be opened by any of the applications installed on your system.

I never said the files couldn't be opened by any of the applications on my system -- I just said the files couldn't be managed by any of them. Note the very important difference.

Regardless, here's an instance that came up just a few days ago: I have multiple computers and have software to deal with a certain file format installed only on some of them. I needed to back up the contents of a USB stick containing some such files on a computer that didn't have the software.

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#325

Post by danssig »

eliben wrote: post #317
danssig wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is your Grandpa doing with a desktop? Get him an iPad, it's all he'll ever need.

Well, he has it since before the iPad. And isn't iPad kinda hard on old people? (shaky hands, etc.)

Actually I keep hearing that their great for the same reasons kids like them: easy concepts to grasp, unlike a mouse for example.

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#326

Post by dpark »

kaishin wrote: post #297
dpark wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So we're limited to either only exposing a dozen operations or somehow shoving 200 operations into a flat UI? This seems to be rather unrealistic.

A dozen operations may be more than enough for 80% of users. Designing for the remaining 20% is a common UI design mistake.

So basically the rest of the operations simply cannot exist? I guess you'll never burn another disk, or create a new folder for that matter.

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#327

Post by JadeNB »

josch wrote: post #276
jarin wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What "advanced" things are you talking about that a regular user would need?

I would love to be able to remove a (huge) file without going through the trash can.

> I would love to be able to remove a (huge) file without going through the trash can.

1. Why?

2. `rm huge-file`

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#329

Post by alextingle »

rat wrote: post #254
alextingle wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is only because the Finder/Explorer has been made harder and harder to use. Apple's OSX Finder is a shocking UI abomination. Their old MacOS Finder was clear and simple - my wife would spend hours arranging her work in coloured folders, each of which opened in a window whose shape and position she had chosen, and was meaningful to her. It was a powerful tool that enabled her to arrange and group her work. Now, b…

I don't know spatial mode was default in Gnome for a while and I think most users disliked it.

Gnome's (and OSX's) spacial mode was rubbish. The whole philosophy of MacOS's Finder ("spacial mode") is to hide applications from the user, and make the whole user experience document-centric. The user opens documents and manipulates them without having to worry about what program they are using to do it.

Wonderful though Linux is, it's applications are not consistent or mature enough to support a totally document-centric UI. Microsoft could achieve that with Office, but they would probably be accused of over-integration, and hit with the anti-trust stick.

Re: Microsoft UI has officially entered the realm of self-parody

#330

Post by alextingle »

richardw wrote: post #309
waitwhat wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That button is called the "Recycle Bin". I believe it has been on the default desktop since at least Windows 95.

A brief Google search confirms that "lost my files" wasn't solved in 1995. I'm pretty sure those aren't all Mac users. Even if 90% are due to other issues, there are many people who would like their data back. I believe many are due to the ease with which a user can delete files compared to the difficulty they experience when restoring them. The dangerous button is much easier to find than the fix-it button. One is r…

Surely Apple's "Time Machine" achieves that? The UI is bizarre and overly flashy, but it's convenient and gets the job done.
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