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U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

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Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#191

Post by Eelongate »

duduer8fttg wrote: post #164
Groxx wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

huh. that's basically the opposite of what I'd think of it as - on the American side of things, I read that as "shake them and see what falls out", i.e. see what they're hiding. I'm also not sure how to search for that kind of phrase though. "a good shake" / "give them a good shake" doesn't seem to find anything relevant in my google. Anyone know of effective ways to search for culturally-idiomatic phrases?

From usage in this scenario, the actual term you want to search for is "fair shake". You're thinking of "shake down" or possibly "shaking the tree" which is why it seems odd.

Yes, 'fair shake' is the term. Wiktionary defines it as "Reasonable, unbiased treatment; a fair deal." and provides examples from both American and British newspapers, so it seems to be used on both sides of the Atlantic.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#192

Post by amprolh »

mrtnmcc wrote: post #168
plandis wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whose culture is right? What is right in the eyes of the law? Perhaps I’m the only one who feels this way based on the number of pro-China posts, but a Chinese hegemony would likely be a world of censorship and social credit. Compared to a flawed US democracy I’ll take the US democracy every time.

China is culturally an ancient agrarian society focused more on defending farmland than conquering nations. This is not really comparable to the U.S. which is an ideology-based nation that inherited European imperialism traits. China is not interested in controlling or imposing beliefs in the same way it's rivals are so we shouldn't interpret their actions with the same lens.

> culturally an ancient society

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution

> China is not interested in controlling or imposing beliefs

China is extremely interested in controlling and imposing the beliefs that the CCP is the best and should never be opposed and never makes mistakes, and demonstrates this daily within the great firewall and through threat of sanction against international media companies, nevermind the regular disappearance of high-profile individuals that cause "problems"...you know, to have a nice months-long chat with them that isn't about controlling or imposing beliefs.

> China has not had the imperial history

There are a number of formerly, currently, and soon-to-be-no-longer sovereign countries that don't want to be part of China, but China pretends they're not occupying/colonizing them by insisting they have always been part of China.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#193

Post by dhx »

judge2020 wrote: post #136
russli1993 wrote: post #125

On Aug 2020, a US spy satellite moved close to a Chinese satellite, attempting to shadow it closely. It was caught by the Chinese and they maneuvered it to get away from the US satellite. This seems to constitute ill or malign intent. Why would you go and bother the property of another person? What is the intent behind this move? Trust goes both ways, and it takes effort from both parties to build trust. This kind of…

What could possibly be gained moving a satellite closer to another? Threatening to crash into it?

It could theoretically be many different things:

- To assess what the satellite is capable of doing

- To geolocate where signals from Earth are originating

- To analyse patterns of multi-spot beam steering and bandwidth re-allocation

- Test denial of service attacks

- Test attacks where signals (or return signals) from Earth are manipulated (e.g. radar signatures faked)

- Test attacks where signals (or return signals) from the satellite are manipulated

- Eavesdrop on unprotected communications

- To waste fuel on the target satellite as it maneuvers to avoid any of the above (even if nothing is attempted)

- To make the other party second guess their technology for no good reason, lowering their confidence in its accuracy or usefulness

I'm sure there are plenty of other possible explanations which could be added to this list.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#194

Post by aaron695 »

> U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

Give one example if it's true.

The time the Russian satellite went close to others was well known about.

A daily attack will be noticed by 3rd parties if true.

I'm not sure there's a single example?

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#195

Post by steve76 »

nraynaud wrote: post #25

I just love the complete lack of self-awareness. Russia and China bad, the US is good.

A few fools here take foreign money and run their mouths and peace remains something you have to work for instead of something that's just there. The reckless ambition of an adolescent mind on a broadcast camera dooms us all. These great efforts should focus on genetic neurological regenerative medicine and xenotransplantation of the cardiac and hepatic systems. Leave entire oceans undefended. Make putting on armor and wielding instruments of ill-omen a historic barbaric relic, coarse self-inflicted plagues and natural disasters. Why? Spoiler alert. You die.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#196

Post by Eelongate »

Mountain_Skies wrote: post #54
dylan604 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there anything from the ground that can be done by Space Force to protect assets in space from direct attack from projectile weapons? Is there anything Space Force can to from space to protect them? No? Then what have they actually done except get new uniforms and patches?

Unified space command into a single branch. Also gives a way for Congress to appropriate funds to the USSF with the Department of the Air Force and not deal with the USAF wanting to repurpose the funds for aircraft, which apparently has been a problem for quite a while. Space is its own unique domain and should be treated as such.

The USAF have a love affair with fast jets (who can blame them?) but I have a feeling that using manned aircraft as the first stage of missiles is an anachronism that won't survive the next major war.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#197

Post by Groxx »

emodendroket wrote: post #189
Groxx wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

huh. that's basically the opposite of what I'd think of it as - on the American side of things, I read that as "shake them and see what falls out", i.e. see what they're hiding. I'm also not sure how to search for that kind of phrase though. "a good shake" / "give them a good shake" doesn't seem to find anything relevant in my google. Anyone know of effective ways to search for culturally-idiomatic phrases?

That's because the more usual form is "a fair shake." Here is a definition: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/a%20fair%20shake > informal : a fair deal : fair treatment > The judge gave him a fair shake, requiring him to perform community service. > She expected to get a fair shake from her boss.

That one I recognize, yeah. Though in retrospect it's rather similar sounding...

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#198

Post by jazzyjackson »

plandis wrote: post #154
nraynaud wrote: post #25

I just love the complete lack of self-awareness. Russia and China bad, the US is good.

You think that Putin and Xi are the good guys here? You really think the world would be a better place if the US let them be the world’s super powers?

i’m on the US’s side, but for the fun of playing devil’s advocate, it could be that the US resisting the assent of Russia/China is the very thing that unifies them under totalitarianism (common threat and all that) - China and Russia might have had their governments overthrown already if it weren’t for the US giving them something to fight against.

Every group turns toward infighting once the outside threat is defeated.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#199

Post by unobatbayar »

mrtnmcc wrote: post #168
plandis wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whose culture is right? What is right in the eyes of the law? Perhaps I’m the only one who feels this way based on the number of pro-China posts, but a Chinese hegemony would likely be a world of censorship and social credit. Compared to a flawed US democracy I’ll take the US democracy every time.

China is culturally an ancient agrarian society focused more on defending farmland than conquering nations. This is not really comparable to the U.S. which is an ideology-based nation that inherited European imperialism traits. China is not interested in controlling or imposing beliefs in the same way it's rivals are so we shouldn't interpret their actions with the same lens.

I just can't comprehend the fact that this kind of disgraceful, ignorant trash is coming out of a SpaceX Satellite Engineer.

Re: U.S. satellites are being attacked every day according to Space Force general

#200

Post by bagels »

sudosysgen wrote: post #187
greeneggs wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see why looking at something closely is evidence of "malign intent." After all, the whole point of spy satellites is to look closely at other countries. You could say that it is risky, because there could be a collision, but that is quite different from malign intent, and this risk can be greatly mitigated.

You can see very closely from a distance at satellites. If you're getting close it's probably to tamper or to signal the capability to do so.

They get close to take detailed pictures to understand capabilities.
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