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Divorce does funny things

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Re: Divorce does funny things

#161

Post by michaelmior »

c_prompt wrote: post #157
watwut wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If men file for custody they get 50/50. Men who ask for full custody also statistically win more often. You are doing disservice to both kids and men when you tell them they cant have it.

> If men file for custody they get 50/50. Men who ask for full custody also statistically win more often. You're pulling that statistic from where? At least from the US census bureau, here are the stats from 2002 that go all the way back to 1994 [1]: "In the spring of 2002, an estimated 13.4 million parents had custody of 21.5 million children under 21 years of age whose other parent lived somewhere else. About 5 of…

The statistics you cite are related, but doesn't refute the point that men who ask for full custody win more often. I don't know if that's true or not, but it can be true and also only 1/6 custodial parents being fathers can be true. It simply requires that significantly fewer men ask for full custody.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#162

Post by me_me_me »

dlsa wrote: post #81

If you have much to do with family court you'd fully understand why suicide is a way out for men treated like sources of money with little other value. It would be quite educational for all men to attend family court as an observer prior to marriage. They might reconsider marriage as an institution altogether. Society itself might have to realise how badly things are set up. Maybe not. Everything's fine. Enjoy your s…

> They might reconsider marriage as an institution altogether.

While I dont disagree with your statements, the statistics don't lie.

Men in marriage live longer and healthier lives on average to men in long-term relationships and to single men.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#163

Post by varjag »

brigandish wrote: post #129
varjag wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you consult arxiv every time you jaywalk?

If you wanted to defend laws against jaywalking then perhaps it would best to back it up with something other than an appeal to emotion, and - on HN of all places - an appeal against using scientific research . That's a tough sell if you ask me.

I'm impressed how you jumped from me using a reasonable commonsense estimate (deceptive people tend to be less trustworthy) to conclusion that I must be anti-science.

Reminds of the droning crowds who claimed in March 2020 that masks don't work "because there is no supporting research".

Re: Divorce does funny things

#164

Post by Zababa »

boredtofears wrote: post #127
cm2012 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's one thing to be upfront. "I love someone new, let's divorce / some other arrangement." There will be hurt feelings but that's life. The honesty will help everyone in the long run. It's entirely another thing to sneak around - to do something you promised not to do, but in secret, so you don't get caught. It is my observation and experience that the kind of person who breaks trust in secret is not someone I want…

If you admit to loving someone new you've very likely already cheated at the emotional level if not the physical. Where do you draw the line?

I've never heard of "cheated at the emotional level". I don't understand how this could be a thing, you don't control your emotions. You are however somewhat free to act on them or not.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#165

Post by spywaregorilla »

MeinBlutIstBlau wrote: post #39
pcbro141 wrote: post #11

Decline of marriage, high divorce rate, increasing single parent rate, inflation/wage stagnation, young men increasingly 'opting out' and sexless, doesn't sound good for the future. The relationship market in the West seems horribly broken, not good at all if you want a thriving happy society.

Not to mention men get no benefit out of marriage anymore. I mean there was some book I remember reading on reddit from the 1920s or 40s where women were not supposed to reject their husbands advances. Now you could be tried for sexual assault as a couple ffs. On top of this, divorce universally screws over men. When you create incentive programs such as divorce, a population doesnt take long to adapt to the institut…

> Not to mention men get no benefit out of marriage anymore. I mean there was some book I remember reading on reddit from the 1920s or 40s where women were not supposed to reject their husbands advances. Now you could be tried for sexual assault as a couple ffs. On top of this, divorce universally screws over men.

God this is creepy. If someone doesn't want to have sex with you, and you force them to, that's rape.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#166

Post by icu »

cm2012 wrote: post #58

On infidelity - to some extent people's personal business is not my business. But if I hear that someone was unfaithful to their spouse, my business trust in them goes waaay down. If they're willing to break trust with the person closest to them in their life, what chance do I have as a mere business partner of not being screwed over at some point?

I've come to see that people are far more complex than what you may think, and that complexity arises from a process of self discovery.

To address your point, the cheating could have arisen from emotional issues that hadn't been consciously acknowledged and couldn't be addressed until after the cheating occurred. If that person goes through therapy and deals with their dysfunction I'd suggest it was a transformative process and you're not dealing with the same person who cheated.

To what degree should you make someone pay for something they didn't do to you?

Haven't you made mistakes and learnt from them and grown as a human?

All I'm suggesting is to be very cautious about passing character judgement on others based on old data. You may be fine with the false positives but it's a lagging indicator at best.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#167

Post by throwaway211116 »

thriftwy wrote: post #158
kkjjkgjjgg wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean? I don't understand anything of what you are saying? What am I trying to take that isn't mine? (And why me, I am not the OP)? What is a five finger discount?

Five finger discount is when you steal. The condition of staying in good relations with your wife where she does not take the children and blast off is not having a romantic life on the side. You understand this condition but try to get around it by lying. Not because it is unfair or impossible. Just because you want to have good things without paying for them.

I find your stance to be incredibly naive and (yes I will use the word) sexist.

Are you claiming that having an affair is the ONLY reason a woman might leave a relationship. Do you truly believe that as long as you do not f** someone else she should be chained to you? Do you truly believe that is all that is necessary for maintaining a relationship?

You do not even realize the implications of what you are saying. If the only way a woman would be allowed to divorce was if the man cheated, that means that the optimum strategy for a woman in a bad relationship wanting to end it would be to make the life of the man hell and push him towards an affair. Of course, this would only be possible in the absence of the possibility of domestic violence directed towards the woman.

I am a man, european and I am NOT a progressive, but viewpoints like yours truly make me see that some of the most extreme and angry fringes of (in this case, feminism) might have a point. Your viewpoint is so narrow, it dehumanizes women. This american style puritanism (and the hypocrisy embedded inside it - statistically, places where this view is wider spread are also places with a higher percentage of offenders) is truly baffling.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#168

Post by 3pt14159 »

vecinu wrote: post #128

As a recently ( Obviously therapy is a good first resource and then working on yourself going forward is a good strategy but man, I can totally understand how some men are obliterated when children are involved and the other spouse is out for blood. I consider myself lucky that it happened before I got too old, had children and who knows what other things could have happened but damn, it still hurts.

I'm so sorry that that happened to you. I hope you've got a solid support system of friends and family around you.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#169

Post by icu »

3pt14159 wrote: post #159
atoav wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Technically everything can be used to establish a (operational) perception of a person — and everything can be wrong. Someone wears a Rolex? Maybe they are rich and want to show off, maybe they inherited it from a dying family member. If they however additionally drive a super car, wear designer clothes the likelyhood of alternative explainations goes down. If someone is a nice, cordial and all around good person and…

The most enlightening bit I read online on this subject was that of a serial cheater who held no remorse for doing so. Her attitude was basically something like: > Hey, I love him and if he doesn't know it doesn't hurt him and if I ask for permission not only will it hurt him, but he won't give it to me anyway. So I'll just lie to him. Which kinda blew my mind. I understand cheating as a I-messed-up thing or as a my-…

That sounds like a personality disorder which is why you should thoroughly vet a long term partner and screen for personality disorders early on in a relationship. I hope the husband finds out and recovers from the betrayal.

Re: Divorce does funny things

#170

Post by Jensson »

varjag wrote: post #163
brigandish wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you wanted to defend laws against jaywalking then perhaps it would best to back it up with something other than an appeal to emotion, and - on HN of all places - an appeal against using scientific research . That's a tough sell if you ask me.

I'm impressed how you jumped from me using a reasonable commonsense estimate (deceptive people tend to be less trustworthy) to conclusion that I must be anti-science. Reminds of the droning crowds who claimed in March 2020 that masks don't work "because there is no supporting research".

Cheating on a spouse has nothing to do with deception, it only becomes deception if they don't tell their spouse about it afterwards. If a person did cheat on their spouse and told their spouse about it then that is a sign to me that I can trust what the person say. I wont be able to trust that they can control themselves in the moment, but at least I'll trust that they will tell me about important things.
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