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Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

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Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#121

Post by dgudkov »

mthoms wrote: post #114
newsclues wrote: post #89

Canadian government funded media outlet defends the government’s actions. There was a reason people complained about the government’s funding of media.

Sigh. This article is based on scientific evidence. Please leave your politics out of it. Anyways, the vast majority seem perfectly happy with the CBC. Fewer than 1 in 5 Canadians want CBC funding decreased: poll https://ipolitics.ca/2019/05/13/nearly-80-of-canadians-want-...

This poll was done in 2019. Things were a bit different back then. The majority is probably still happy with CBC, but the proportion could change.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#122

Post by rubyist5eva »

mthoms wrote: post #118
rubyist5eva wrote: post #24

Paid off in what exactly? Many of our provincial governments have implemented totalitarian measures despite an insanely high vaccination rate and low death rate - creating a medically segregated society. In one province, the government has given itself vast power to perform warrantless search, confiscate property and conscript any person to the cause of "managing the emergency". Our courts uphold the measures because…

>In one province, the government has given itself vast power to perform warrantless search, confiscate property and conscript any person to the cause of "managing the emergency" I've not heard of that. Which province?

Saskatchewan. Recent developments are that they are pulling retired police officers out of retirement in order to enforce mandatory isolation at “secure isolation sites”.

https://sun-nurses.sk.ca/pub/docs/member-resources/COVID19/M...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/saskatchewan-covid-...

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#123

Post by rubyist5eva »

xiphias2 wrote: post #77
ipaddr wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The government's actions I can understand. The courts decisions based on 'unprecedence' events is troublesome. It creates a low barrier for the removal of any rights. An event will happen like this again.

Removal of rights is one thing that is debatable. Not giving them back when the emergency has been gone and in developed countries everybody who wanted to get vaccinated got it is clearly an overstep.

When the government gives themselves power in an emergency, they most certainly are incentivized to keep finding new emergencies.

Frankly, the checks and balances on our government have completely failed.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#124

Post by ipaddr »

coronqueue wrote: post #42
ipaddr wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tracking is through vaccine checkins via vaccine passports. Boarding any travel method in Canada now requires a vaccine checkin. These passports will remain a long time.

Vaccine passports in Canada are implemented using the https://smarthealth.cards/ standard. The QR codes are verifiable offline using digital signatures. The app used in BC is open source and available on Github: https://github.com/bcgov/BCVAX-iOS https://github.com/bcgov/BCVAX-Android It works just fine with the device in airplane mode, and does not maintain a record of the QR codes it has verified.

Let's look at the details a little closer.

You download a QR code from the government. You are identified at this point and linked to your test results given your QR code.

Those open source clients are for BC only. Assuming the app store version matches those clients that ensures you are not being track in private businesses during a vaccine check.

This doesn't ensure the federal system is using the same clients or other provinces.

This doesn't ensure a vaccine passport check before boarding a train by a government official doesn't link your travel/location.

The only thing we are sure is this will protect tracking at the private level in BC if the business has airplane mode on and both have downloaded and built the client themselves.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#125

Post by curryst »

bserge wrote: post #78
Proven wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For now. Six months from now you'll need another booster.

It's gonna be an yearly thing, isn't it. Now with a digital pass so you need to get a paid vaccination or be restricted. Bet my life that's what's gonna happen.

It feels like it is. I'm torn on it. I don't like the removal of personal choice nor the potential for tracking.

I'm curious what the impact of anti-vaxxers is. I know they're more likely to catch and spread COVID, but can the constant low-grade COVID situation be blamed on them entirely or are they just exacerbating it and to what degree?

It really feels like we need to quantify that in order to make a call on how far we're willing to go to force compliance. If COVID would be largely gone without them, perhaps extreme measures are in order. If COVID is only 1% worse because of them, do we all want to make that sacrifice to force compliance?

The reality is likely somewhere in the middle and far more murky. I still think it's worth considering that there are a spectrum of options, and extraordinary measures should be justified by commensurate extraordinary circumstances.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#126

Post by tomohawk »

newsclues wrote: post #89

Canadian government funded media outlet defends the government’s actions. There was a reason people complained about the government’s funding of media.

Driving through Canada, the bias of the CBC was quite obvious, and there was very little if any competition from any other outlet.

That said, the information being provided here is in accord with known science of vaccination, and is based on voluminous data. If you have a legit complaint about what they're saying, you'll need to provide some legit data that backs you up.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#127

Post by tomohawk »

refurb wrote: post #3

“Bold” strategy? Canada had no option if they wanted to vaccinate quickly. Unlike the US and Europe, Canada dragged its heels on pre-ordering vaccines. Once it was apparent they couldn’t control the case numbers without vaccines, they took what they could get, prioritized first doses then realized they had different vaccines delivered for 2nd doses. The fact the mixed vaccines gives good protection is more luck than…

Given what is generally known about vaccination, it was not bold. It was judicious.

However, given the hysteria of what passes for news outlets and social media, it was quite bold. People were convinced that the 2 week interval initially specified for Pfizer vax was bedrock truth. Any departing from that ONE TRUE WAY could only be bad. In such a political climate, actually following the known science was difficult.

Giving 1 shot to everyone and spreading out the shots to a more normal interval allowed a lot more people to get immunity. Gettin the 2nd shot at a longer interval allowed those people to get a better long term immunity.

Tbis is not an earth shaking discovery. If it worked differently than this, people would be asking why is this vax different?

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#128

Post by tomohawk »

Interesting note: any Canadians wanting to work in the US or go to school in the US would be forced by policies here to get vaccinated YET AGAIN, because US policy is not about safety or immunity, but about compliance with a partisan position.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#129

Post by jszymborski »

wk_end wrote: post #34
jszymborski wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking of nationalising the medical industry: Fun fact, Canada was the home of Connaught labs, a publicly owned laboratory which was the first lab to produce the Salk's Polio vaccine, and went on to produce the Smallpox vaccine. In the 1970s, however, Canada went on a privatizing spree (incidentally, the same gov't that ratified NAFTA), and Connaught was privatised and sold many time since. More info here https://w…

Your dates are a little off. The 70s had little to do with it - Canada’s privatization spree under Mulroney lined up with Reagan and Thatcher. So Connaught Labs was destroyed in the 80s by the Mulroney Conservatives. And NAFTA was ratified in the 90s by the Chretian Liberals, although it was Mulroney’s baby.

Yup you're totally right. I got mixed up with Connaught's sale to the Canada Development Corporation in 1972, and again confusing NAFTA's ratification with Mulroney's gov't.

Re: Canada's 'gamble' on delaying, mixing and matching Covid-19 vaccines paid off

#130

Post by jszymborski »

refurb wrote: post #17
jszymborski wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking of nationalising the medical industry: Fun fact, Canada was the home of Connaught labs, a publicly owned laboratory which was the first lab to produce the Salk's Polio vaccine, and went on to produce the Smallpox vaccine. In the 1970s, however, Canada went on a privatizing spree (incidentally, the same gov't that ratified NAFTA), and Connaught was privatised and sold many time since. More info here https://w…

Canadian pharmaceutical R&D and manufacturing is almost entirely gone at this point. A big part of that was little interest in supporting the industry from the government. Apparently a vaccine manufacturer approached the government a while back and got a tepid response so decided to invest elsewhere.

That's definitely true, but I've some hope we'll be getting some back with the new gov't labs being built, and the AI hubs in Montreal and Toronto pushing the pharmacogenetics story.
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