If China is claiming that Hong Kong citizens are foreign agents, aren't they implicitly admitting that Hong Kong isn't part of China?
Maybe they are, but they can say whatever they please if the mainlanders don't see it
Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
61–70 of 538 posts
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
How? Another war? I'm having a hard time believing the economic elite in the US will be in favor of loosing business in China.
It's a good question. Assuming war is the only option on the table: 1. Would Americans be in favor of (relatively) short term destruction in favor of long term prosperity for their children and future generations? 2. Would the US be able to win a conventional war against China? I believe the answer to #1 is no. I don't think anybody knows the answer to #2.
On 1, let's not pretend that short term destruction necessarily leads to long term prosperity. We've "won" most of our recent wars, long term prosperity was not the result.
On 2, there is no conventional war with a nuclear power.
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#63[flagged]
Reading this, I find it funny how so many people have an image of their "enemies" in their minds and laugh at the idiocy they've mentally constructed for these enemies.
Every time Communism comes up on Reddit I see a thread like OP's satirizing
I don't know if I've ever seen anyone spouting that philosophy on HackerNews though..
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#64I visited this museum in 2016. It was incredible to see this on Chinese soil. Hong Kong had a mere 20 years of being truly Hong Kong, free of the UK and generally free of China. Now it is just more China.
Communist China has only had a mere 100 years compared to it's 5000 year history.
and 5000 years of dictator rule, not sure what you are trying to say
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#65The Chinese Government is speeding up their efforts to swallow Hong Kong and Macau into the Mainland. Closing the media outlets, museums, websites that speak against them. And a few key people get abducted here and there to scare more people and force them to accept the Beijing Regime. But... The people from Hong Kong still demonstrates and tries to fight for their lost rights.
The only reason Hong Kong has had this period of independence is a side effect of western power subjugating the Chinese mainland. As the Chinese mainland grows in global power and the west decays into internal squabbles there should be no expectation that the pretenses of western power will remain intact.
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tiananmen Square protests were not separatist, either.
Foreign-backed regime change operations are rather separatist in my humble opinion
The growing unrest amongst students, people and the political elite was caused by divisions within the party.
Deng Xiaoping believed in the need of absolute authority.
The death of general secretary Hu Yaobang (a reformist) fueled anxieties about the future of the country.
Foreign-backed regime change??
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#67The power balance between the US, UK, and China in 1984 was far more in favor of the US and the UK than it is now and they still caved to Chinese demands vis a vis Hong Kong. Given the state of global power balance now, there is not a chance in hell that any of the West will do anything (except maybe words) to support the Hong Kong.
The U.S. did nothing in the arrangement because their position wrt the CCP was one of engagement to balance against the USSR.
It was the UK, which caved because, as revealed in now-declassified democratic cables from 1958, Zhou Enlai flatly stated that the PLA would invade if HK was given independence.
The UK quite simply could not defend HK. It had failed to defend it in WWII against Japan (it couldn't even defend Singapore) and would have no hope against the CCP, even without the Harbour Tunnel to the Kowloon Peninsula, which had already been operating for some time.
Instead it opted for an agreement in the joint declaration and a hope that the CCP would lean more towards international norms as the Shanghai cadre assumed more control. Objectively a poor solution but, I have to say, probably the most rational.
Of course, we all know what happened. Deng's best laid plans came to naught and another 'great leader' emerged.
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#68Earlier quoted context omitted.
How? Another war? I'm having a hard time believing the economic elite in the US will be in favor of loosing business in China.
Sponsor relocation to US/UK/Taiwan for any HK citizen who wants it? HK will have 0 value to China if every educated person leaves it.
If they could leave
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#69Earlier quoted context omitted.
Very sad and parallels what seems to be happening in the US and other western democracies as well. There is a trend of certain dominant power in all of these countries that is quashing all opposing voices. I predict that some major global events are going to happen within the next few years. EDIT: Case in point - the quashing of opposing voices occurs on this board on this very comment. You cannot even bring up this…
The parallels are: Both driven by the left. Both claim nothing will happen, it’s just a myth, people are just being paranoid. Purge is the common theme across the history of leftism.
The Nazis were totally right-wing. Their purges shocked the world. It's not just a left-wing thing, it's a common theme across all forms of extremism. Left, right, religion-based (look at the Taliban now, they don't really fit in the left or right category at all)... It always comes down to the same thing. Not listening to the other person but choosing to silence them with violence instead. The flag they wave is different but the extremism remains the same.
What we need is balance. Left and right together. Agreeing to disagree and finding a way to work together anyway. That's democracy. It's hard but it's the only way.
Re: Hong Kong: Police Raid Tiananmen Square Museum
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
Expressions of white supremacism (N word, etc) & separatism (Jan 6, etc) are heavily suppressed in USA.
Yeah, I don't know how America can be considered a so-called "free country" when the people living there will get angry at me for using slurs and being generally discriminative. I'm sure it's just a matter of time until they create some kind of unethical legal punishment too, as they did with expressions of anger (assault, murder, etc.).
I hope you forgot the /s.