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It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

thehill.com

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Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#101

Post by YLYvYkHeB2NRNT »

aynyc wrote: post #86
atrus wrote: post #12

Painfully obvious too. My little local Mexcian place will be closing down because of a lack of cooks. Talking to the owner, he was complaining about government benefits, and how they all want $20 an hour. I don't understand it, that you'd either a) be willing to drive your business into the ground serving a limited menu because you won't hire a couple cooks at $20 an hour, or b) have a business so close to the brink…

You forgot option c) raise the price of the menu to cover the cost.

As a health care service provider, this means I'm dropping your insurance plan and you pay my fees directly. Are you okay with that?

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#102

Post by gruez »

hanniabu wrote: post #49
mananaysiempre wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prices can be very, very sticky? In my city it appears (to my uninvolved eye) that several levels of floor space sublessors need to run out of lessees by raising prices in order to pay (possibly their debt to) the higher levels, with a couple months’ latency for each, until retail can reasonably exist again.

If they start raising prices then CPI will start reflecting true inflation, and we can't be having that!

Inflation would look bad for politicians, but I doubt small business owners are ruining their business just so BLS can put out slightly better inflation numbers.

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#103

Post by mananaysiempre »

tarr11 wrote: post #62
mananaysiempre wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The demand may just go elsewhere, like “screw it, I’ll just go to the supermarket”—not sure how plausible that is in a US context specifically, but surely there’s a possible world where the majority of people just stop eating Mexican or even most street food.

We stopped eating out nearly as much during the pandemic and replaced it with higher quality groceries and prepared foods from delivery services.

I’m sure a lower-quality segment will emerge once the whole thing has time to equilibrize :) And in some places the social aspect is not insignificant. (In others you’re better off without it, true.)

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#104

Post by throwaway675309 »

rebuilder wrote: post #25
n8cpdx wrote: post #4

It's surprising businesses haven't turned to automation. At the very least, most of a restaurant's and a coffee shop's labor can be replaced with automated ordering, having the customer collect food themselves when it's ready, and using robots to prepare more of the food. they can do lattes with art all by themselves now. A lot of these businesses just can't survive if they meet the wage demands of people who have be…

The problem with this is, if the barista gets automated, the customers buy better coffee machines and stop going to the cafe. An exaggeration, but you see my point perhaps. Unless your service is really purely about bang for buck, trying to automate it in ways that are visible to the customer can have downsides. McDonald’s could probably go full robotic. Starbucks? Not sure, maybe. It would be a little offputting. Yo…

I don't see your point at all - most people that I know including myself who go to a coffee shop go to be able to sit down and relax for a few hours and enjoy the atmosphere/ambience provided by the physical environment and other customers in proximity.

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#105

Post by lordnacho »

n8cpdx wrote: post #18
MattGaiser wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or they could just have raised prices.

All of the local restaurants have raised prices. I've overheard a few restaurant owners talking and it seems customers don't like even small price increases. They also indicate the price increases are necessary for supply costs even as they raise wages and can't fill positions. A lot of restaurants are just cutting menus/services to be able to stay on top of demand. This strikes me as hugely economically inefficient,…

The thing that might happen is that restaurants become unrecognizable. For instance if it all turns into dark kitchens on delivery sites. (Dark kitchen: restaurant without a traditional storefront that sells exclusively through a portal like Deliveroo).

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#106

Post by kdmccormick »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #17
angelzen wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Business does understand the free market. It is also strongly incentivised to exhibit perpetual exponential growth. Perpetual exponential growth is impossible even on relatively short duration spans (decades), see the parable of the rice and chessboard. Business tries to maintain the illusion of perpetual exponential growth by making cuts everywhere it can: worker compensation and product quality. https://purposefocu…

Underrated comment. A lot of “growth” is tricks. I have seen so many software companies sacrifice the fundamental health of the product in order to hit certain “growth” numbers, on the assumption that they’ll just be able to keep doing it. But the more realistic outcome is either acquisition (pass the buck and reset the clock) or catastrophic failure.

See:

* Strongarming new user account creation even though most new users will immediately bounce.

* Removing features from the free tier to "drive conversions" to premium, whilst ruining the quality of the free tier that drew users in the first place.

* Filling the product with re-engagement nagware and notification bloat.

etc.

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#108

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

atrus wrote: post #12

Painfully obvious too. My little local Mexcian place will be closing down because of a lack of cooks. Talking to the owner, he was complaining about government benefits, and how they all want $20 an hour. I don't understand it, that you'd either a) be willing to drive your business into the ground serving a limited menu because you won't hire a couple cooks at $20 an hour, or b) have a business so close to the brink…

The thing about being a business owner, is that you are the last one on the payroll (if you are a good owner).

All the bills get paid (including wages), then you get what's left over. If you had a good week, then you get a nice stack of Benjamins. If you had a bad week; maybe not so much. In fact, you may even need to chip in, to keep the lights on.

I have seen, many, many SMB owners start living "high on the hog," as soon as they start doing well. They buy a 5-bedroom house in a marqée neighborhood, a C-class Merc., LV bags, etc. I know, for a fact, that most of them make far less than I ever did. Frequently, they get the company to pay for a lot of it (put one bullet in the chamber, and give it a spin).

They have gotten used to living large, and it's damn difficult to downsize, after that.

So that means they need to do everything they can, to make sure the last pile is as big as possible; regardless of how the corporation is performing.

If they banked on hiring undocumented workers, or skilled artisans at rock-bottom prices, and that pool dries up, they are left with the choice of leasing a Subaru, and selling the Jag, or trying to make whoever has been loyal enough to stick around, fill in the gaps.

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#109

Post by aynyc »

YLYvYkHeB2NRNT wrote: post #101
aynyc wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot option c) raise the price of the menu to cover the cost.

As a health care service provider, this means I'm dropping your insurance plan and you pay my fees directly. Are you okay with that?

If the choice is between no health care or pay a higher price? Then yes, I'm OK with that. That's what people do without health care.

Re: It's not a labor shortage – it's a wage and workers rights shortage

#110

Post by jzb »

rvense wrote: post #60
toomuchtodo wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with a bundle of Great Clips a friend manages for a franchisee. Can’t find staff, doesn’t believe staff are worth what the current effective minimum wage is. “Have you tried offering more?” “That’s too much for cosmetology work.” Getting slapped by the invisible hand of the market.

> “That’s too much for cosmetology work.” So it's not even an economic argument, "If I pay that I'll go out of business"? It's just a moral one, "They don't deserve that amount of money"? I can't say I'm surprised, TBH.

That's the crux of it in a lot of cases. People have come to view a certain class of work as "not worth" paying a living wage. What's worse, the jobs they view as "not worth" a living wage are the ones that do the work we need (or at least really really want) done.

If all the cooks, servers, cosmetologists, janitors, lawn care / landscaping, delivery drivers, warehouse workers and so forth stopped doing their jobs... everything would suck real quickly. But somehow we're not willing to pay them a living wage.

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