How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life? • Hacker News Board

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#691

Post by darksaints » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:49 PM UTC

refenestrator wrote: post #618

vidarh wrote: post #614

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is there mercy and grace in being unwilling to make an effort to show the utterly minimal respect of e.g. addressing them how they prefer? There's a ruthlessness to it in large part because of a recognition from many that asking nicely has been met with immense vitriol, anger, even violence in some cases. At some point you stop asking and start demanding. See also Karl Poppers paradox of tolerance: https://en.w…

I can only correct this so many times, so here's my drop into the ocean on this thread: The paradox of tolerance is that if you're too tolerant to nazis, they might take over everything and you wind up with less tolerance. It is NOT a get out of jail free card for "you don't have to be tolerant to people that you label as intolerant, in fact terminate them with prejudice". You need a credible threat of the 'bad peopl…

We live in a democratic society. Intolerant ideas, held en masse, have a way of becoming laws. It is worth fighting them, even if they're not wearing swastikas.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#692

Post by j4kp07 » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:49 PM UTC

jensensbutton wrote: post #660

angelzen wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ibram X. Kendi: Any disparity in group outcomes is proof of a deeply flawed and malicious system. The darling of American academia and corporate. You can either have equality of opportunity and accept that the outcomes will be disparate, or have equality of (group) outcome. You can't have both. Your friends have not thought through the consequences of the current dominant ideology. > 'When I See Racial Disparities, I…

Ibram X. Kendi is one person. You can find individuals who espouse any view you want. The question is are there any large groups actually pushing for this. Though the parent didn't, I would s/large/mainstream/ because the internet makes it easy to find large groups of people talking about any old topic.

In other words, a subjective opinion is being asked that anyone can disagree with and similar to "cancel culture", we're just going to pretend this does not exist.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#693

Post by CapricornNoble » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:50 PM UTC

afarviral wrote: post #436

CapricornNoble wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>>I think sorting and discriminating on IQ is the only way to build some form of cohesive society. IQ, and for other men, testosterone levels. John / IQ140 / 300ng/dl: Peter / IQ90 / 300ng/dl: Tyrone / IQ105 / 1100ng/dl: <--- Take detailed notes when he explains how to get Instagram models to pay you, after seducing them in a grocery store. Disregard his opinion on global military strategy.

a) IQ is disputed b) what? srs?

a) agreed b) not really...but there is definitely an aspect of communication that is lost when all voices are reduced to just text on a screen. I can understand how people might want to add objectively-measurable characteristics to online bios and leverage assumptions about lived experience to rapidly assess the relative value of otherwise-seemingly-equal posts.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#694

Post by zpeti » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:50 PM UTC

brokencode wrote: post #687

zpeti wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately this laissez fair approach is the exact opposite of modern wokeness. It’s their way or it’s attacks and cancellation. If you’re an oppressor class you have almost no way to be forgiven. The easiest way to show this is just ask some woke stars on their views of libertarianism, which is literally to let everyone be themselves.

From my experience, what libertarians really want is freedom for themselves. They do not actually care how their actions affect others. For example, I’ve yet to meet a libertarian who cares about their carbon emissions, even though that affects everybody else via climate change. Same goes for coronavirus - they don’t care if they spread the disease to others, but they feel like it’s oppression if they have to wear a…

The ACLU supported the rights of neo nazis to protest in a Jewish neighborhood. While not strictly a libertarian organisation, that is exactly the attitude. And libertarians would support that too. The rights of others to be free just like myself. It’s not selfish in any way.

And you should read up about why the aclu did this, they say some very relevant things to today.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#695

Post by cloudfifty » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:51 PM UTC

zpeti wrote: post #669

yawaworht1978 wrote: post #327

It's just a shift from older, less flexible values like family, church etc to the more open minded approach, "do as you like". Nothing wrong with people having tattoos everywhere, green or violet hair, non conformist clothing and views. Let them be, let them express and find themselves. I am the shave every day suit kinda guy and will remain so, but if someone chooses to be different or wants to complain about new wo…

Unfortunately this laissez fair approach is the exact opposite of modern wokeness. It’s their way or it’s attacks and cancellation. If you’re an oppressor class you have almost no way to be forgiven. The easiest way to show this is just ask some woke stars on their views of libertarianism, which is literally to let everyone be themselves.

> libertarianism, which is literally to let everyone be themselves

No, it isn't. Its core is to enforce private property rights? That will very likely not translate into "letting everyone be themselves".

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#696

Post by bequanna » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:51 PM UTC

zpeti wrote: post #669

yawaworht1978 wrote: post #327

It's just a shift from older, less flexible values like family, church etc to the more open minded approach, "do as you like". Nothing wrong with people having tattoos everywhere, green or violet hair, non conformist clothing and views. Let them be, let them express and find themselves. I am the shave every day suit kinda guy and will remain so, but if someone chooses to be different or wants to complain about new wo…

Unfortunately this laissez fair approach is the exact opposite of modern wokeness. It’s their way or it’s attacks and cancellation. If you’re an oppressor class you have almost no way to be forgiven. The easiest way to show this is just ask some woke stars on their views of libertarianism, which is literally to let everyone be themselves.

Indeed. The woke are experts at placing people into endless categories and determining which is “good” or “bad”. Which are the “oppressors” and the “victims”. Listen to their rhetoric, it is pretty much the opposite of live and let live.

One of the more ridiculous ideas to come out of this is that “everything is a human construct”. For example, it appears to be a woke idea that mathematics, science is some human (more specifically, white) invention and we should explore “alternative mathematics” or “alternative science”. Perhaps a new (and most importantly less oppressive) scientific method is right around the corner.

Like a long forgotten music video that you talked about with all your friends, most of these ideas will end up with no relevance and are completely meaningless. Wokeness is primarily an attention-seeking social phenomenon where influencers can tell you the new hot woke which you can mention later to impress your friends or get a date.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#697

Post by platz » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:52 PM UTC

DethNinja wrote: post #680

I think people are over-analysing this issue here at HN. It is far better for upper class to ensure that people discuss and focus on issues like gender and skin colour than the class differences. Hence, they ensured that this is the issue plebs would hear all over on the media and shift their attention from class divides to gender and skin colour.

proceeds to detail conspiracy

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#698

Post by ahallock » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:52 PM UTC

The "woke" movement uses the same tactics as religions. Followers try to shame you and offer absolution for your original sin of racism or transphobia. There are different sects of wokeness, similar to denominations in the Christian Church. It's also a form of mob mentality and bullying. Corporations, unsurprisingly, have also jumped on the trend.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#699

Post by silisili » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:53 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #549

Our political and cultural institutions are dominated by people who attended those elite schools. This is the next batch of folks who will be doing your IPO paperwork: https://freebeacon.com/campus/northwestern-law-administrator... Now it’s making the jump to K-12. My second grader is apparently learning how to develop an “identity” around her “skin tone” (according to an email from her teacher). This has had the pre…

Skin color identity in second grade? That's so ridiculous, I'd be pretty upset if I found that out. Let kids be kids. Anyhow, thanks for sharing.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#700

Post by bushbaba » Sat, Sep 04, 2021, 2:54 PM UTC

busterarm wrote: post #96

bluedino wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hispanics don't get it either.

Indeed. The only ones I've ever seen push it in the workplace are the ones that never learned how to speak Spanish. Telling.

With them shoving their privilege into others. The exact thing they preach not to do.