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The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

theatlantic.com

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Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#291

Post by nkohari »

jcrben wrote: post #85
colordrops wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it's not. There's still no evidence that there is any real risk to children. Please prove otherwise. Anecdotes and one in a million cases don't count.

Nearly 300 hospitalized per day, nearly 500 dead so far. https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/07/health/children-covid-19-prot... Unknown how many will long-term health effects. Even seemingly innocuous viruses like Epstein-Barr are tied to various health problems later in life. Why should we knowingly expose an entire generation to a little understood virus?

Influenza kills thousands of people under 18 every year: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html

We are actually _incredibly_ fortunate that Covid spares children to the degree that it does.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#292

Post by stackbutterflow »

nobleach wrote: post #74
argvargc wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And despite killing ten times as many people as COVID, these changes were achieved without destroying small businesses and jobs, plunging millions into poverty (and likely later starvation), gross human rights violations and police brutality, and reintroduction of segregation into previously free democratic societies. (Just like with all other communicable diseases of modern times.) Go us.

Well, keep in mind that the transmission vector of HIV and SARS COVID are completely different. If we had found in the 80's that HIV was transmissible by simply breathing the same air as those infected, we'd likely have seen a similar response... without all the "work from home" benefits that we currently enjoy.

Conversely, I'm trying to imagine what would have happened if hiv had appeared in the social media age.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#293

Post by ineedasername »

greyivy wrote: post #239
outside1234 wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's unpopular. More precisely, once the vaccine is available to all age groups, the only people that need to be scared of it are the unvaccinated. And they will have had every opportunity to get vaccinated, so we shouldn't optimize for them.

Not the immunocompromised or those who are legitimately unable to get vaccinated? Not a very nuanced take.

Then those people should be at least as scared of the unvaccinated as COVID itself. That will be their primary infection vector.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#294

Post by q1w2 »

Pyramus wrote: post #82
nradov wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that the virus will necessarily evolve to become benign, but rather that most people will get infected when they're young and build up natural immunity which protects them later in life. This is what already happens with the other 4 endemic common cold coronaviruses. Each of them probably killed a lot of people when they first emerged. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7252012/

This is the correct answer and should be highlighted more. The virus doesn't evolve to become benign, it's the hosts that will evolve. In addition to the endemic coronaviruses that you stated, another example are endemic/seasonal influenza strains vs. new strains. (Yes the virus will evolve but in general mutations will optimise for transmission and be indifferent to lethality.)

This is not exactly true. Keeping your infectious host alive longer, will increase transmission.

This is why there is an evolutionary pressure for all diseases to keep your host alive, and why some diseases/parasites ultimately evolve to be less harmful/lethal.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#295

Post by WillPostForFood »

erhk wrote: post #278
rossdavidh wrote: post #36

Good article, but doesn't mention the other reason that covid-19 is never going completely away: animal reservoirs. We know that dogs, cats, hamsters, guinea pigs, mink, white-tailed deer, a gorilla, and a tiger have been found to have been infected with covid-19. It is implausible that it will ever cease to have an animal reservoir, especially given the finding in Canada of 30% of white-tailed deer having it. Of dis…

This is mostly irrelevant from my understanding. Of the few diseases that humanity has eradicated, one is found in wild animals. Animal resevoirs are simply not the problem.

What disease are you talking about? Smallpox doesn't have an animal reserve, Rinderpest doesn't infect humans.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#296

Post by s5300 »

josephcsible wrote: post #174
jrockway wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe "mask requirements" are a sign of society advancing? There was a time in human history when we didn't bathe regularly, or brush our teeth, or have sewage removal systems in cities, etc. Maybe the next step is "you know, breathing in particles that came from the other 600 people in this railcar is not so great". I certainly don't see a reason to go maskless on public transportation in the future. And, as supply…

You're saying society should keep wearing masks everywhere literally forever? That's so insane I can't tell whether you're even serious.

Ahh, I too remember when escalators instead of stairs were seen as so insane that the public couldn't tell whether the mall owners were serious...

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#297

Post by guscost »

outside1234 wrote: post #229
h3cate wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion but as countries get majority vaccinated they have to learn to not be as scared of it.

I don't think that's unpopular. More precisely, once the vaccine is available to all age groups, the only people that need to be scared of it are the unvaccinated. And they will have had every opportunity to get vaccinated, so we shouldn't optimize for them.

Yep, you're gonna leave us alone from now on. Also I'll decide for myself what to fear, thanks.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#298

Post by N1H1L »

PartiallyTyped wrote: post #167
rossdavidh wrote: post #36

Good article, but doesn't mention the other reason that covid-19 is never going completely away: animal reservoirs. We know that dogs, cats, hamsters, guinea pigs, mink, white-tailed deer, a gorilla, and a tiger have been found to have been infected with covid-19. It is implausible that it will ever cease to have an animal reservoir, especially given the finding in Canada of 30% of white-tailed deer having it. Of dis…

How does covid transmit to wild animals like deer that have almost no interactions with humans ? The transmission chain must be very long. I'd appreciate any links or resources to read more. Perhaps we can learn to be more mindful of our interactions with other animals, wear masks in public spaces or public transport, and hopefully WFH becomes a permanent option. It seems that I stepped on many nerves, please, feel f…

It could be simply from a human being to their dog, who chases a deer and passes it on.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#299

Post by q1w2 »

mrfox321 wrote: post #42
HarryHirsch wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know? HIV hasn't evolved to be any less deadly in the 40 years it has been around. Instead, there's most excellent treatment available and people have changed their behaviour.

HIV has evolved to be less deadly: https://www.pnas.org/content/111/50/E5393

...and also, 40 years is not a long time for disease evolution. ...especially one like HIV which has a much lower transmission rate than a respiratory virus.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#300

Post by s5300 »

2trill2spill wrote: post #215
KineticLensman wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's why I don't really understand why there are still covid restrictions in countries that are close to full vaccination, like the UK I cracked some ribs three weeks ago and coughing / sneezing are really painful. I am keeping my mask on because I really don't want even a mild cough, for whatever reason. More generally, the vaccines are not 100% effective, the virus can still be transmitted and spread. For lots…

So you want country wide restrictions solely for your own comfort? Sounds incredibly selfish.

You really don't see the irony in this statement, do you.
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