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Thunderbird 91.0

thunderbird.net

161–170 of 279 posts

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#161
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think language matters, and de-normalizing language with a root in slavery is a good idea.

Also, on that note some Slavic countries might request their naming and history be changed to something delinked from slavery... Shall we rename Slovenia and Slovakia, too?

The root of the names Slovakia (Slovensko) and Slovenia (Slovenija) trace back to "slovo", literally "word" (denoting people who speak the same language).

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#162
post #4

CardDAV address book support Although it's sad that this will replace the plugins that provide this feature, it's good to see support built into the core and a continued investment in implementing standards.

I welcome the integration, but how'd you even turn it on? Nothing in the settings I can find after installing.

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#163
post #67
post #9

Can someone explain what the deal with 91 is? I'm on 78, and no updates are found. On the submission's web site there is "Thunderbird version 91.0 is only offered as direct download from thunderbird.net and not as an upgrade from Thunderbird version 78 or earlier." Why is that? Is upgrading safe? And thunderbird.net only offers me 78, anyway.

For years Thunderbird has been poorly maintained and releases were skipped. This release is to align Thunderbird version with Firefox version... but I don't know why.

Afaik they only rebase on Firefox ESR, not Firefox stable.

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I suspect employees want their work to make them feel good in terms of alignment with their bedrock principles. if it makes you feel good to play with words I am not sure if thats a good energy expenditure for your activism. it feels like a cheap way to value signal instead of doing something actually meaningful.

Words have meaning and power. How they are used literally changes the discourse. Your participation in this discussion is proof that the example under consideration has impact well beyond "playing with words."

"Words have meaning and power"

Except when they don't.

That's the point.

This change is completely meaningless in practical terms, which means the only value derived is in the heads of those wanting to see the change.

This is why we view it cynically.

Someone commenting cynically on the action does not 'prove' that those words have some kind of influence.

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My company made the change from blacklist/whitelist to blocklist/allow list over two years ago and people, mostly external, still get annoyed and I just can't understand why. The former is literally one letter different and the latter makes just as much, arguably more, sense than the term it replaced. I get that some people see it as just posturing but you have to start somewhere if you are going to change the cultur…

I mean honestly, this is typical US stuff. As a european I have never associated blacklist, whitelist or master with any discrimination. Why instead of changing tech wording affecting every dev worldwide who does not care about american pseudo social justice, just do not call dark er skin „black“ and brighter skin „white“? I mean still more people are afraid in the absence of light, hence the dark, than otherwise. An…

> Better just stop associating this pink skin with „white“ and darker skin with „brown“ or „black“.

It is not only about colour but about racial identity.

This article describe this case:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jul/25/race-east-ja...

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Master/Slave nomenclature is considered "problematic language" (because it harks back to slavery), and thus often replaced with more PC language these days. My organization had a whole "fix this nomenclature throughout the whole codebase" week (things like "black-/whitelist, master/slave, ....)

the word "master" predates american slavery (apparently the only slavery people care about) blacklist predates black people being enslaved in America. It's PC war on words that distorted their original meaning.

The word fa***t predates it’s use as a slur for homosexuals, but I don’t think anybody reasonable would argue that it’s not commonly perceived as an offensive term. These are obviously different degrees of subjective “offensiveness”, but my point is that people don’t sit down and work out the etymology before deciding if something makes them feel bad.

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alternative perspective on exactly the same data: This kind of developer-driven change does not wind me up, because developers working on products should be able to reflect on how those products are part of society and if they choose to make changes in their branding, presentation, or diction, they should be able to do so. Mozilla has a pretty rich tradition of employee activism, as we all observed after the Eich deb…

My company made the change from blacklist/whitelist to blocklist/allow list over two years ago and people, mostly external, still get annoyed and I just can't understand why. The former is literally one letter different and the latter makes just as much, arguably more, sense than the term it replaced. I get that some people see it as just posturing but you have to start somewhere if you are going to change the cultur…

By this logic probably 1/3 of literature is going to have to be banned or edited.

Using 'light' for 'good' which mostly derives from daylight, the sun, daytime etc. and darkness for 'bad' etc. might be the most ancient human metaphor, probably dating back to the time we could tell stories. Our first religion, in Egypt, the Sun was God and the God of the 'Dark Underworld' was the bad guy.

Moreover, it doesn't really have connotation with respect to skin colour.

The important, 'hard' part to social activism is context and nuance and also to understand that not all actions which may have some threadbare logic make sense or actually help.

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#168
post #66

Seems it still doesn't have automatic archives. I want to copy my emails automatically to a defined location without an addon.

Can't you use Message Filters for that usecase? "Move to" and "Copy to" are available actions there or do you just explicitly want an "Archive" option for the filters?

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#169

> "Master Password" renamed to "Primary Password" How does the term "Primary Password" describe the password which enables access to the list of credentials better than "Master Password"? Are they just entertained by the alliteration?

I sometimes wonder how much there could be done for people in need of an actual form of help if all that energy to change unrelated words because someone is triggered by them went into a more useful endeavor. And beyond that, maybe it is because I am not a native speaker, but isn’t “primary” less clear than “master” in this context? `Master` suggest control/mastery over something, but `primary` rather focuses on impo…

The point is not about actually helping anyone, it's in-group out-group signaling. Once you understand the real purpose you will understand it's effective.

As long as you are taking it at face value you will continue to be confused in this way, and you will continue to lose.

Re: Thunderbird 91.0

#170

What is this talk about Calendar support? Does that mean we don't have to use the lightning calendar extension?

AFAIK you already don't have to use that addon anymore since at least 78 or even earlier. Eg. my only addon in Thunderbird is "Provider for Google Calendar" so that I can sync my calendar with my Android phone other than that I've not used Lightning in forever.
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