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Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

fortune.com

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Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#161

Post by ho_schi »

bamboozled wrote: post #88
ho_schi wrote: post #76

Probably we shall take into account, that journalist like to spread bad news! Looking back at the previous variants, the vaccines keep working. This is good news! What will bring is into trouble are non vaccinated people which build a big resource pool for Covid-19 to become more aggressive. Lockdowns, removal of rights or masks cannot eliminate Covid-19 (so called short term workarounds) but the vaccines can make it…

> What will bring is into trouble are non vaccinated people which build a big resource pool for Covid-19 to become more aggressive. I've heard a different story from an interview with Robert Malone, the creator of mRNA vaccines [1] [1] https://www.bitchute.com/video/ukx8L3lh5CA7/

The fact that the "Creator of mRNA" got a own Wikipedia page only two weeks ago makes me suspicious. And that his name is only listed on questionable websites. And I've learned that big things are usually not created by one person. The developments around mRNA are mostly attributed to Katalin Karikó, Ingmar Hoerr and Robert Langer - over a long time period.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#162

Post by jasonlaramburu »

School-Cotton wrote: post #3

Buried the lede: > At the same time, protection against hospitalization and serious illness remained strong. I.e., Delta is more likely to get you sick, but you’ll still turn out fine.

>but you’ll still turn out fine.

Unless you get long covid.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#164

Post by sjwalter »

NeutralCrane wrote: post #107
Justsignedup wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically in NZ they have nether vaccine nor any remaining covid. Because they solved it as a community. Instead we created a global persistent pandemic. Cool.

NZ's strategy only makes sense with eventual vaccines. There is no chance that this disease would ever not become endemic. The world is too large, and too many countries don't have the advantages NZ does (comparitavely wealthy, isolated, low population density). They deserve props for keeping their population healthy until this point, but the idea that it can continue indefinitely, or that it was ever feasible for a…

NZ's strategy (and all lockdown strategies) never made any sense and it was obvious from the get-go.

Very early into the pandemic, we learned three crucial facts:

1) Covid is non-transmissible outside. 2) Vitamin D is a potent inhibitor of respiratory illness in general and covid in particular. 3) Obesity is the greatest risk-factor associated with covid.

With these taken into account (and all are very well-supported by many of those peer-reviewed studies everyone seems to need in order to take any action), the best course of action is to encourage everyone to go outside, hang out with friends, don't wear masks outside (because this discourages going outside), exercise, and soak up lots of sun.

The next "big wave" of covid in the northern hemisphere is going to come in the winter, just as all "seasonal illnesses" do. In fact, there's at least one study out lately that indicate that there's nothing seasonal about illnesses, but that vitamin D deficiency, brought on by staying inside during the cold months lowers group immunity and causes increased illness.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#165

Post by mindslight »

SuoDuanDao wrote: post #140
mindslight wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Education and intelligence are necessary for achieving autonomy. In general, it's hard to take claims for "autonomy" seriously when so many people's decisions seem to be arrived at by uncritically following social media.

That cuts both ways. I remember the finger-waggers - for weeks - mocking people who chose to wear a mask in the early days of the pandemic, with the same tone of smug superiority they today reserve for people who choose not to. I'm a lot more worried about those types of people than the type who arrive at what look to me like sillier conclusions but don't seek to impose them on everyone.

I agree on the priority, but the latter types are ultimately still imposing the consequences of their decisions onto others - their extended families when they want to visit, their friendships where they can't help but pushing the nonsense into every conversation, public spaces if they're not actually continuing to wear a mask and social distance, institutions that are going back to business as usual (eg schools), etc.

I'm all for making one's own decisions and going against the grain (eg wearing a mask at the start of the respiratory pandemic). I'm just saying that the dissent seems to consist of very few well-reasoned viewpoints, and a whole lot of herd following and outright nonsense.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#166

Post by sjwalter »

thinkcontext wrote: post #157
cm2187 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To catch it or to get sick from it? Either way it would be fine. It basically reduces it to the level of a common cold, ie we can stop worrying about this virus.

The unvaccinated can't (or shouldn't) stop worrying about it. This means they are less likely to be protected by other people being vaccinated.

Those who've already had covid and recovered never have to worry about it either.

Also those under age 40 that aren't fat don't have to worry about it either.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#167

Post by damontal »

chopin wrote: post #118
oldgradstudent wrote: post #53

This has nothing to do with the variants. They've changed the testing policy for the vaccinated, so more of the vaccinated are getting tested. The efficacy was artificially high before because the vaccinated were rarely tested and therefore rarely reported as infected.

Do you have sources for this?

anecdotal but my son has had cough and fever for the last week. we took him to the urgent care at the hospital and because he's vaccinated they didn't even bother with a covid test.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#168

Post by jasonlaramburu »

School-Cotton wrote: post #38
datameta wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except there would be no need for an ever present risk of lockdown if every single country simply locked down for 3-4 weeks a year and a half ago. But no, muh freedomᵀᴹ and the economy!! are far more important considerations that certainly didn't turn out to actually be incredibly short-sighted. I'm lucky to live in a place with >70% vaccination rate. So this no longer comes from a place of grievance toward personal…

> if every country simply locked down for 3-4 weeks This is an absurd fantasy that couldn’t have been possible in the real world. > But no, muh freedom, and but the economy! Your mocking tone is out of place. I do in fact think freedom and the economy are both important. Don’t you?

>This is an absurd fantasy that couldn’t have been possible in the real world.

China and the countries of Oceania did just this and have largely suppressed COVID without MRNA vaccines. China has a massive, porous land border. They've protected themselves from inbound infection by quarantining all visitors on arrival.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#169

Post by sjwalter »

samatman wrote: post #122
trackerme wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sars-cov-2 is an easy virus. We still can't create a vaccine against HIV (but we have some ideas).

A better (by which I mean more accurate) framing is that HIV is a very difficult virus. It hides inside the immune system itself! It writes itself into your DNA ! Diabolical stuff when you think about it.

It's also really, really easy to avoid getting HIV.

Re: Israel data reportedly shows efficacy drop of Pfizer-BioNTech for delta variant

#170

Post by mindslight »

swiley wrote: post #152
mindslight wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Education and intelligence are necessary for achieving autonomy. In general, it's hard to take claims for "autonomy" seriously when so many people's decisions seem to be arrived at by uncritically following social media.

To be quite honest: I'm not comfortable with my current education level regarding the vaccine considering the pretty aggressive censorship everyone has been doing with information on it.

I agree, which is why I don't feel terribly autonomous with respect to my decision to get vaccinated. The best I could do was wait several months to see if anything major shook out as they scaled up.

But the autonomy applies to the decision process, and not the specific choice. Choosing the contrary conclusion is just as non-autonomous.

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