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Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

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Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#511

Post by throw123123123 »

kumarvvr wrote: post #83
throw123123123 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where do you think the salary comes from in the beginning?

At the beginning of civilized society? From the government itself. Then it slowly evolves into capital flow to people closely connected to the government (aristocrats, royalty, etc) and then to common people through banks. You seem to imply that for any entrepreneurship, you need to have no worker protections at all. But that is simply false.

> From the government itself

There is no government possible without incomes that support it. You got this exactly the other way around.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#512

Post by etempleton »

MereInterest wrote: post #175
etempleton wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the marketing agency world 50-60 hour weeks are the norm and 70 hour weeks occur once a month or so. It isn’t really sustainable. Most people burn out and leave the agency world within three years. Those that stay often make work their life or have a way where they can set their own schedules, which is usually because they have reached marketing executive level and the work becomes different. It is a very unhealth…

How much of that is working time, and how much of it is sitting in a room not being productive? Every productivity study I've read finds that per-week productivity drops off tremendously with that level of overwork.

Productivity per hour drops, but it doesn't matter to the agency because all of their employees are salaried. It is not people sitting in a room not being productive per se, but it is a bunch of burned out employees not being as efficient as they could be.

Again, this leads to burnout and employees that are sufficiently burned out either quit or are fired for no longer being able to meet the productivity requirement and/or making mistakes. The agency does not care because the supply of recent college graduates in marketing and communications is never ending (it is one of the most popular majors at almost any college/university).

Interestingly, slower work to a point is better for the agency since they bill the client per hour. That reverses when the quality of work suffers or the employee is no longer able to get everything done that was promised to the client. The agency gets more value out of a single employee when they work longer hours. Bonuses are common in the agency world, but they are typically meager compared to the extra hours worked. Burning out their junior employees is then to the advantage of an agency that bills by the hour.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#514

Post by AYBABTME »

isatty wrote: post #25
paxys wrote: post #17

It's an open secret at least in the tech world that absolutely no one is putting in a productive 40 hours of work a week. This was true well before the pandemic and is more pronounced than ever now. Everyone needs to be "present" for 8 hours a day 5 days a week, but spends their time in pointless meetings, preparing documents and powerpoints that no one will read, faux social/teambuilding events, hour long lunches, g…

What’s wrong with an hour long lunch? Isn’t that normal?

It's too short is what's wrong!

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#515

Post by ghshephard »

8note wrote: post #135
ghshephard wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say the opposite - the only job I can imagine (outside of the first two years of investment banking) working 60+ hours/week would be a startup - where each and every hour in those first 2-3 years can make the difference between building a Billion dollar company or just getting left behind.

The only time id do that is if I was the founder. Employees are too likely to be screwed over, even if the company is successful

I mean, a lot depends on your level of seniority, what type of equity you negotiate, how likely it will be diluted, whether you are likely to have a $100mm/$500mm/$1B exit. A lot depends on the integrity of the CEO in the event of an acquhire (probably the most common exit) and how well the Principle engineers will be compensated (Retention Bonuses usually).

I will agree with you - it's probably batshit insane for a working stiff without a good chance of a $2mm+ payout to be working 60+ hours/week for years on end.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#516

Post by kortilla »

savingsPossible wrote: post #475
someguy321 wrote: post #453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You pay for that service whether you realize it or not.

Apparently not? The cost can come from the margin for the gas station, not the consumer

LOL. Who do you think you’re buying the gas from and who sets the price?

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#517

Post by GordonS »

formatjam wrote: post #201
paxys wrote: post #17

It's an open secret at least in the tech world that absolutely no one is putting in a productive 40 hours of work a week. This was true well before the pandemic and is more pronounced than ever now. Everyone needs to be "present" for 8 hours a day 5 days a week, but spends their time in pointless meetings, preparing documents and powerpoints that no one will read, faux social/teambuilding events, hour long lunches, g…

meanwhile, China is doing 996 - 9am to 9pm, 6 days a week. Obviously people hated it. But it is happening and no wonder China tech is catching up fast / winning in some areas already.

As someone who has worked in a dev office in Beijing for a bit - no. Devs routinely took up to 2 hours for lunch breaks, and took numerous breaks in a day. I didn't blame them, mind, because the reason was obvious - for most people, it's just not possible to be completely engaged and invested for 12 hours a day, 6 days a week, forever. I'd estimate there was about 4-5 hours a day of properly productive work going on.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#518

Post by CRConrad »

kortilla wrote: post #494
fy20 wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of these customer facing jobs will be abandoned or optimised away in the next few decades. Front desk work could be done away with mostly by electronic systems (most of the time when I "check in" it's just picking up a ready made room card as I checked in online). You could even centralise the "talking to a human" part in a call center operating a number of hotels, who delegate to staff on the premises (house ke…

> Fuel pump operator hasn't been a job in most Western countries for decades, as you just pump fuel yourself Nope. See Oregon and NJ, unless you don’t these American states to be part of these “Western countries”. In general, don’t respond to examples of jobs that actually exist now with a hypothetical world where they don’t exist to state something about the current world.

> > Fuel pump operator hasn't been a job in most Western countries for decades, as you just pump fuel yourself

> Nope. See Oregon and NJ, unless you don’t these American states to be part of these “Western countries”.

Two states out of fifty. Maybe, in general, don’t respond to examples of jobs that hardly exist any more with a tiny and dwindling part of the world where they’re still just barely hanging on and pretend that has any relevance to the world economy.

(As for the US as a “Western country”... Well, sure, at least geographically.)

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