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Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

thestar.com

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Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#61

Post by hammock »

spywaregorilla wrote: post #34
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

I feel like what people really want is a wealth weighted income tax, so your tax rate on income is based on how wealthy you are, not how much you made in a single year.

Under that system you would be rewarded for not productively generating any cash flow from the assets you own.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#62

Post by seanmcdirmid »

germinalphrase wrote: post #21
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

“ It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell.” Unless, of course, we’re talking about the only meaningful asset an average person might own -their house- then we tax its assessed value every year.

Property taxes fund local services and act as pressure for property to be put to productive use; they specifically exist so property isn’t used solely as a speculative investment. I’m not sure what a tax on general investment would do but discourage speculative investment in general.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#63

Post by seanmcdirmid »

dankboys wrote: post #50
germinalphrase wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“ It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell.” Unless, of course, we’re talking about the only meaningful asset an average person might own -their house- then we tax its assessed value every year.

Indeed, taxes exist to keep the middle class down, we should switch to a flat tax.

I’m not sure how regressive taxation is going to improve the middle class’s lot?

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#64

Post by jcheng »

ykevinator3 wrote: post #51
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

Agreed but paying an exec $1 in compensation salary and $100m in stock should also be illegal.

If you pay an exec $100MM in stock, they’re taxed on it the same as $100MM in cash, no? They’re just not taxed if their stock appreciates by $100MM and they never sell it. (And if they do sell it’s taxed as capital gains)

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#65

Post by [deleted] »

ykevinator3 wrote: post #52
nickpp wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

During COVID governments spent and spent. Now the check must be paid. By us, as always. Since income is already taxed at about 50% pretty much everywhere in the developed world, it is time to tax the existing wealth. These articles are meant to prepare the public for it. They influence but also measure the public support for a wealth tax. It could be an all wealth or only a unrealized capital gains tax, similar to pr…

Or it's time to cut government payroll by 50%, shouldn't we at least explore this ?

[deleted]

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#66

Post by germinalphrase »

dankboys wrote: post #50
germinalphrase wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“ It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell.” Unless, of course, we’re talking about the only meaningful asset an average person might own -their house- then we tax its assessed value every year.

Indeed, taxes exist to keep the middle class down, we should switch to a flat tax.

A flat tax on what? Income? Wealth?

I’m not against the idea so long as we make it progressive at the very bottom (though I understand my motivations there are explicitly moral ).

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#67

Post by jcadam »

mprev wrote: post #38
nickpp wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

During COVID governments spent and spent. Now the check must be paid. By us, as always. Since income is already taxed at about 50% pretty much everywhere in the developed world, it is time to tax the existing wealth. These articles are meant to prepare the public for it. They influence but also measure the public support for a wealth tax. It could be an all wealth or only a unrealized capital gains tax, similar to pr…

Are you suggesting that governments are colluding with journalists to deliver a particular narrative? Or are you saying that journalists and their editors believe there's a need for wealth taxes and so they're pushing that line?

Probably some of both. A wealth tax would discourage investment and encourage consumer spending, and would hit the middle class the hardest. As usual - these things are always sold as being targeted at the "rich."

Though, it would be interesting to see how people would try to game/avoid it. Instead of investing in stocks, a middle class person looking to preserve some wealth could buy things like physical gold/silver from local dealers with cash, hide it under the floorboards, and definitely NOT report it on their taxes.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#68

Post by bko »

lastofthemojito wrote: post #36
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

Previous discussion of this ProPublica story rightly pointed out that there was too much focus on billionaires (legally) not paying taxes while their assets are appreciating (but not yet sold), and not enough focus on the fact that often taxes aren't even eventually paid (a grey area mix of legal/illegal). From the original ProPublica article [0]: >It’s clear, though, from aggregate IRS data, tax research and what li…

I think it's best to simplify when possible. Just get rid of the charitable tax deduction or cap it at a certain amount.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#69

Post by jcadam »

japanuspus wrote: post #59
Aqueous wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough - however, what would the equivalent of this look like for invested assets? We are basically forced to sell to cover every year to pay taxes on accrued value?

Eh - yes? What would be the problem with this? On a practical level, if this was implemented, I am sure the market would quickly create funds that payed out at exactly the right level to fund this. Here in Denmark, ETF's are always taxed this way and any losses can be carried forward. The one area where this can get problematic is things like a a big family business that is not providing enough profit to pay the tax.…

Governments just spent the last year killing small businesses to the benefit of large ones, so this would help them finish the job.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#70

Post by dfxm12 »

nickpp wrote: post #27
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

During COVID governments spent and spent. Now the check must be paid. By us, as always. Since income is already taxed at about 50% pretty much everywhere in the developed world, it is time to tax the existing wealth. These articles are meant to prepare the public for it. They influence but also measure the public support for a wealth tax. It could be an all wealth or only a unrealized capital gains tax, similar to pr…

During COVID governments spent and spent. Now the check must be paid. By us.

The already wealthy benefitted immensely from the pandemic [0]. Hopefully, governments understand this and by "us", they realize they need to tax based on that, and not some scheme where the people already most negatively impacted have to bear the brunt of it.

0 - https://www.forbes.com/sites/chasewithorn/2021/04/30/america...

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