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Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

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Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#21

Post by germinalphrase »

Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

“ It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell.”

Unless, of course, we’re talking about the only meaningful asset an average person might own -their house- then we tax its assessed value every year.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#22

Post by LinuxBender »

Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

Agreed. My favorite breakdown of this view is from David Mitchell [1] I am not sure what would happen economically if we started taxing all assets, non-income, etc... How much should people pay yearly on wedding rings, gold teeth, clothes, music collections? Would we have to itemize all possessions and have them assessed?

[1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2q-Csk-ktc [potentially nsfw language]

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#23

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

kasey_junk wrote: post #15
chromatin wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I pay zero percent on my wealth, just like you. You should consider revising your comment as you were duped by poor journalism.

You could calculate your income tax to wealth ratio though right? The reason it’s important is that these executives are not paid “income”. Their wealth increases because it’s largely in shares of their companies and then they use non (or low) taxable events to get cash to buy their stuff. This sort of activity is not available to people whose only source of cash is income. I’m not sure it’s worth the unintended cons…

From my point of view, it is poor journalism to use a clickbait headline ($13.6 billion is not little-to-nothing) and misleading presentation of data (incomes taxes of X on wealth of Y).

It's also lazy journalism as it just piggy-backs on top of the illegally-obtained IRS data from ProPublica, and produces all of its quotes from Twitter or other news media sources.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#24

Post by Aqueous »

germinalphrase wrote: post #21
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

“ It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell.” Unless, of course, we’re talking about the only meaningful asset an average person might own -their house- then we tax its assessed value every year.

Fair enough - however, what would the equivalent of this look like for invested assets? We are basically forced to sell to cover every year to pay taxes on accrued value?

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#25

Post by furgooswft13 »

johnrbent wrote: post #12
chromatin wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I pay zero percent on my wealth, just like you. You should consider revising your comment as you were duped by poor journalism.

I'll admit, I read it as income. But it does make me start to think about the disparities in how wealth is generated across different classes of Americans. For me, wealth is almost 100% generated by my income, so I would say my income tax is basically a wealth tax.

> so I would say my income tax is basically a wealth tax.

Indeed, sounds like a great reason to abolish the income tax.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#26

Post by sombremesa »

germinalphrase wrote: post #21
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

“ It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell.” Unless, of course, we’re talking about the only meaningful asset an average person might own -their house- then we tax its assessed value every year.

On the other hand, cap gains on the sale of your primary home are taxed extremely favorably.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#27

Post by nickpp »

Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

During COVID governments spent and spent. Now the check must be paid. By us, as always. Since income is already taxed at about 50% pretty much everywhere in the developed world, it is time to tax the existing wealth.

These articles are meant to prepare the public for it. They influence but also measure the public support for a wealth tax. It could be an all wealth or only a unrealized capital gains tax, similar to property taxes. They could start with executives and entrepreneurs who are mostly paid in stock. We will see.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#28

Post by LinuxBender »

Retric wrote: post #20
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

Except property tax is a wealth tax. So we have a wealth tax, it’s just highly regressive. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Property_tax_in_the_United_Sta...

Property tax is interesting but probably in a different category as you are sharing space/property with a local government. I hope we have a historian here that knows the background and rationale on property tax. It is interesting that it is tied to the value of the property and not simply based on the size of the lot.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#29

Post by QuixoticQuibit »

Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

The recently proposed wealth taxes (e.g., Elizabeth Warren’s proposal) that work the way you’ve described would only start on wealth above $50 million.

So your framing of such a tax as a way to steal from your working-class retirement funds is incredibly disingenuous. Unless, of course, you have 8+ figures of wealth. In which case I hope one day you’re made to pay your fair share to society.

Re: Wealthiest U.S. executives paid little to nothing in federal income taxes

#30

Post by jstummbillig »

LinuxBender wrote: post #22
Aqueous wrote: post #14

I'm a little baffled why there have been all these articles of this category recently. It's not news that you don't pay taxes on invested assets you hold and don't sell. That's how it works for everyone who invests their savings. This isn't a 'tax-avoidance' tactic - it's just what owning something is. Are we really advocating for a world where you are taxed just for appreciation? Maybe we are but at least be honest…

Agreed. My favorite breakdown of this view is from David Mitchell [1] I am not sure what would happen economically if we started taxing all assets, non-income, etc... How much should people pay yearly on wedding rings, gold teeth, clothes, music collections? Would we have to itemize all possessions and have them assessed? [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2q-Csk-ktc [potentially nsfw language]

Which begs the question, how happy are we with what is happening economically right now?
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