Live data from Hacker News

Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

mainichi.jp

141–150 of 518 posts

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#141
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you're expected to eat at your desk and type while chewing.

Once upon a time, I worked at a nuclear engineering consultancy. One engineer ate a hamburger and french fries over his keyboard, using it as a placemat, and never cleaned it up. In order to fix his computer, I first used a bottle of alcohol to clean the brown and black muck and hunks from the keycaps. It honestly smelled like a dumpster.

I would just toss that

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#142

Of all places, that this is coming from Japan is astounding. The culture of "company man" in Japan is notorious for essentially absorbing and erasing the line between family life and company life for an employee. There are horror stories floating around on the internet that explain how many stay in office, often later than their boss, just to look like they are working hard. And I have experienced it first hand. Went…

> There are horror stories floating around on the internet that explain how many stay in office, often later than their boss, just to look like they are working hard. The horror story there is in how late that takes them to in many cases. A friend spent a year in Japan. Leaving by 8 was apparently a good day.

It does seem like Japan starts their day a bit later than the US. Perhaps more similar to some businesses in New York where you might roll into the office between 10 and 11, but then stay until 8 or 9 pm. Still a very long day. It is so ingrained in their work culture that closing the office one additional day a week may be the only way to give some time back to employees.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#143
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least in the states most places require you to "make up" your lunch. So normally you'd show up at 8 and work until 5 to make up for an hour lunch. This is true for both hourly and salary.

I think the question is whether that "make up" time is always 1 hour or can be adjusted. At my previous job I would regularly take 15 minute lunch breaks and leave 45 minutes early (compared to a 1 hour lunch). Where I work now local laws require taking at least 1 hours of breaktime per day so I can technically not do that.

I think this is based on local laws, yeah. Where I am at you're required to take a 30 minute break for 6 hours of work. The stipulation is that 30 minutes must be a continuous 30 minutes.

I'm not aware of any law anywhere that says you can't just make your last 30 minutes of the day "lunch" but every company I've ever worked at has frowned upon or discouraged this. Usually by "forced clockouts" ostensibly for legal protection. My salary career has been more lenient but when I was an hourly employee if we ran over the 6 hours we'd get yelled at by HR and/or force clocked out (and told to go to lunch). Labor laws in the states are quite precarious for employers so it's semi-understandable why they do this.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#144

Of all places, that this is coming from Japan is astounding. The culture of "company man" in Japan is notorious for essentially absorbing and erasing the line between family life and company life for an employee. There are horror stories floating around on the internet that explain how many stay in office, often later than their boss, just to look like they are working hard. And I have experienced it first hand. Went…

> There are horror stories floating around on the internet that explain how many stay in office, often later than their boss, just to look like they are working hard. The horror story there is in how late that takes them to in many cases. A friend spent a year in Japan. Leaving by 8 was apparently a good day.

I have heard that this is somewhat offset by rolling up a lot of social/etc time in to work. So they will have dinner at work with the other employees. Still horrible but it helps to understand how they even manage to live while working that long.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#145

Of all places, that this is coming from Japan is astounding. The culture of "company man" in Japan is notorious for essentially absorbing and erasing the line between family life and company life for an employee. There are horror stories floating around on the internet that explain how many stay in office, often later than their boss, just to look like they are working hard. And I have experienced it first hand. Went…

There was a recent study at Microsoft Japan if I recall correctly. There have been rigorous studies throughout the works for some time before that.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Working 60hr/week for a startup is completely illogical. It's the sort of thing you only do drunk on kool-aid.

> It's the sort of thing you only do drunk on kool-aid Did not realise believing in a mission is akin to joining a suicide cult. Work doesn’t have to suck. It doesn’t have to be everyone’s calling. But it is for some of us, and sixty+ hours a week can be time well spent. My time at start-ups has been time around colleagues I love, work I enjoy and a mission I believe in. (I was also decently compensated while there a…

It doesn't have to, but the most likely outcome in a startup is it goes bankrupt, what you did disappears into the dark hole of failed ideas, and no one sees it.

It's a suckers game: the default behavior needs to be "when the founders get greedy and kick me out...what will I do then? How will I feel about that time?"

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#147
post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once upon a time, I worked at a nuclear engineering consultancy. One engineer ate a hamburger and french fries over his keyboard, using it as a placemat, and never cleaned it up. In order to fix his computer, I first used a bottle of alcohol to clean the brown and black muck and hunks from the keycaps. It honestly smelled like a dumpster.

I would just toss that

It was his favorite keyboard. He would've cried, TBH.

Consider it was a place where one guy hoarded 15 years of WSJ in his office.

When staff are excellent professionals in the field, they get to do all sort of weird things.

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#148
post #140

Would this have something to do with improving natality rates?

Well surely that is the only reason why they are pushing for it. And yet most of the discussions seems to be missing the point. ( Discussing Work hours without Japanese in the context ) I am not entirely sure if this will help though. Birth Rate in Japan, ( or in any nation ) is a complex issues. Both cultural and economics. Why would anyone want a baby when they can barely afford themselves decent standard of living…

> when they can barely afford themselves decent standard of living

Rent and food even in Tokyo is much cheaper than even medium sized cities in the states.

People might not be able to afford a luxurious lifestyle in Japan, and economists standard of living models may tell you otherwise, but the standard of living for a typical person in Japan is high

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#149
post #74

I think people might be a little confused about what the government is telegraphing here. Japanese labour regulations are very strict, in particular around hours worked. Basically all employees (yes, including engineers) need to clock in and out, the concept of a "salaried worker" doesn't really exist, although normally engineers are paid for a certain number of hours regardless if they are actually worked. Primarily…

> Basically all employees (yes, including engineers) need to clock in and out, the concept of a "salaried worker" doesn't really exist

裁量労働制 certainly meets the spirit of "salaried worker" if not the letter ("need" to clock in for at least 1 minute to be counted as working for the day).

Re: Japan's government plans to encourage 4-day workweek, but experts split

#150
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work at a company where it is encouraged to use the fitness facilities during work hours. 15 minutes walking to one of the gyms, 5 minutes changing, an hour working out, 10 minutes in the sauna, 10 minute shower, 5 minutes getting dressed, 15 minutes walking back. That is 2 hours of my work day right there ;-)

That sounds marvelous! I'm looking at a job at the moment that is mostly WFH and working out during the day is something I'm looking forward to most of all.

This has changed me - I WFH, but every 2 days I take a 2 hour walk, I walk about 7.5KM to the beach and back and while I’m tired at the end of the walk, it’s hugely invigorating and I often end up coding until well after midnight on my own projects with all the extra energy I have.

Have lost quite a lot of weight too … and it’s only been a couple of months. Go for it! Can’t recommend it enough.

Post reply on HN