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Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

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Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#851

Post by graphtradr »

buildingmateri wrote: post #710
flippinburgers wrote: post #511

Men are not doing as well as women in school. If you look in the wrong places on the internet, media, or daily life, all you see is negativity towards masculinity. In addition, there doesn't appear to be any broad social system that is geared towards supporting men. The fact that men don't tend to be a socially adept doesn't help. This all feels like the perfect storm and there are plenty of people who act like "men…

Especially a problem because for almost all men a career and supporting family (maybe the hardest thing to figure out in life) is non optional, whereas half the female friends I have from college have abandoned careers to saddle up to a breadwinner ... I mean I kind of want that option but men don't really have it. Does anyone ever really discuss this social reality that makes it different for men v women in real wor…

What about the breadwinners half the women are saddling up to?

We have never had symmetry as humans in this area. Low status males don't get to fuck as much. That has always been the case for all human history. This is nothing new.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#852

Post by ajsnigrutin »

anm89 wrote: post #663
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my country, there are 50% more women in colleges than men, and our colleges still work more to attract more women (with eg. girls-only workshops, etc... we used to call this segregation and/or sexism back in my time). Lets say you have Alice and Bob... they both finished college, both are looking for a job, and they both decide to start their own company - Alice will make plastic spoons, and Bob will make plastic…

Curious which country this is. That ratio sounds really high.

Slovenia :)

https://www.uni-lj.si/univerza_v_stevilkah_2018/studij/stevi...

This is the "nicest" image I could find (our statistics bureau has a shitty page, where you cannot directly link to a graph/table, but only to a full dataset where you have to choose 'filters'). The ratio is 60%-40% (which sounds "nicer" than 150% women, but yeah... 15.072 men, 22.802 women (for university of ljubljana, our largest university).

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#853

Post by _smmt »

sgt wrote: post #279
d_burfoot wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a slow motion tragedy. From an environmental perspective, this kind of minimalist lifestyle actually seems quite healthy. They don't drive, and I assume they don't fly or buy a lot of stuff, so their carbon and other resource footprint is small. They don't take up much extra space, so they reduce suburban sprawl and land required for housing. They probably won't have kids, which further reduces their environme…

In the future, it may even be more efficient to hook them up to a large computer that is able to use them as a power source, too. We could offer them a virtual reality completely indistinguishable from reality.

Reminds me of Vanilla Sky

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#854

Post by LunaSea »

throw737858 wrote: post #731
buildingmateri wrote: post #710

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially a problem because for almost all men a career and supporting family (maybe the hardest thing to figure out in life) is non optional, whereas half the female friends I have from college have abandoned careers to saddle up to a breadwinner ... I mean I kind of want that option but men don't really have it. Does anyone ever really discuss this social reality that makes it different for men v women in real wor…

There absolutely is an option to skip career and family. It is 2021, social reality is that women can be breadwinners too. And it will be more and more difficult for women to find a breadwinner.

Actual reality is that they aren't in majority of cases despite representing a larger percentage of college graduates.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#855

Post by 5etho »

throoooway wrote: post #757
twh270 wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. I've had many conversations about this topic with my son (and on occasion some of his friends -- both male and female), since he was in middle school (a decade ago). They're well aware of how men are portrayed versus women. We've transitioned from "A women's place is in the home (barefoot, pregnant, and cooking a delicious meal for her husband)" to "A woman's place is whatever she wants, and men are the reason f…

Dreading this when my sons grow up. “Hey, society and the media and politicians, institutions have all decided your nature is a problem and that you are assumed guilty, to be viewed with suspicion at all times. Oh and for some reason, you should still want to support this structure with your hard work and taxes, and shut up and never mention it.” Honestly - I don’t know why I would tell him he should accept this soci…

look at this american loosing his 'usa usa usa' privilige. Oh no look, at the living in countries exploited by the united states which contain pretty much whole world. Bretton woods, us pertrodollar, war on iraq, etc

you dont believe in your country? how sad

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#856

Post by LunaSea »

mutedpossibly wrote: post #805
username90 wrote: post #587

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most kids spends their first 15 years mostly surrounded by women. Their doctors, their kinder garden teachers, their school teachers etc. Almost every authority figure is a woman there. If those boys have problem I feel it is ok to say that it is mostly those grownups fault, and they happen to be mostly women.

The absence of men in these fields is part of the problem, as you say! However, the absence of men in these fields are by choice. To place the blame on only those that are present in raising everyones children and ignore the fact that most men choose not to be part in this hugely important societal task is (imo) wrong.

And I'm sure that you would also agree that women not being CEO is also a choice right?

After all, they could simply have created their own company.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#857

Post by 2ion »

01100011 wrote: post #471
MattGaiser wrote: post #206

I have a very multicultural background, but the dominant cultural view, at least when it comes to money, is Chinese. For us, living at home is not failure. Moving out without planning to start a family if you live in the same city as your parents is considered wasting money. You instead use it as an opportunity to save a pile of money and invest. How much of this is just cultural change? It isn't failure to launch. I…

This. Caucasian, US born male here. IMO, Western culture is less suited to many of the challenges of the modern world. I don't want to imply that Asian culture is somehow flawless, but there is quite a bit the west can learn if it wants to be efficient and stable in the near future. My half-baked thought is that you can look at world population growth over time( https://ourworldindata.org/world-population-growth ) an…

> Caucasian, US born male here. IMO, Western culture is less suited to many of the challenges of the modern world. I don't want to imply that Asian culture is somehow flawless, but there is quite a bit the west can learn if it wants to be efficient and stable in the near future.

Especially to the economic situation of middle and lower class individuals. For most young people, it is simply __impossible__ to replicate even the family situations their parent generation had with a stay at home wife rearing the children and a breadwinning father -- simply because the real wage stagnation has made it impossible to finance a family without at least two 'good' incomes. Staying in the family home during university perhaps until marriage at age 30, this amounts to 10 years of more efficient spending on rent/mortgage, bills and other shared appliances. Having an extra $100k saved up at age 30 this way can make and break a family project.

Upper middle with >$500k household income at age 30-50 and above likely are in a better economic spot than they have ever been in and not really comparable to the plight of the commons.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#858

Post by jplr8922 »

nradov wrote: post #333
jplr8922 wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the term 'coddling ' is not the best. I grew up during the 90's in a hyper-controled environment by a macho dad and a passive mom. I was told to not become an artist, to not travel when I am young (waste of time), to learn how to drive a car, to get a job, get a degree, all that jazz. The thing is, at 32, I still have no sense of purpose in life. When all the goals are chosen for you, it does not matter if yo…

Having a purpose in life is optional. Supporting yourself as a functional adult in society is mandatory.

I was told that ''fiding your passion is stupid'', and that ''its better to become an unhappy physician than a happy artist''. Since I've hit the job market I've spent thousands of $ in therapy and many weekends in various spiritual activities to reorient my life. And I still my first burnout at 30.

My opinion now is that sense of purpose AND being able to support yourself are essential; you have cash balance to keep in check with the tribe, and an emotional balance to keep in check with yourself. An adult should be able to do both. I think that people who do the former without doing the later may succeed economically, but on the long run they drain everybody and subconsciously expect others to take care of their own emotions. My father was like that, and his own children don't call him 'daddy'.

I also think its a very male difficulty, because boys learn to suppress emotions at a young age. It makes it harder to find meaningful careers, but also to sustain relationships and to evolve in your spirituality. Men drop out of school, do not enter the workforce, and lament that tinder is unfair. In my humble opinion, it is a purpose problem, not a ''how do I clean my room'' problem.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#859

Post by [deleted] »

wolfretcrap wrote: post #50
futureshock wrote: post #22

This seems like a kind rational economic choice. If there are not enough good jobs that can support independent living, providing for a spouse, buying a home or raising a family, then staying home with the easy accomplishment of video games makes sense. Most people never live outside their home states and can't afford to leave the support network of their family and close friends. If you grew up in a medium or high c…

It's less about not having good jobs more about: 1. Most want to start business and become rich, not work for someone else. Starting business is difficult, needs lots of work, even if you are smart and hardworking, have capital to start, still you need social skills which present generation didn't develop, so getting along with others and leading others is still difficult which limits the success. 2. Anything you'll…

[deleted]

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#860

Post by granshaw »

livueta wrote: post #640
vsareto wrote: post #498

Idk, playing video games all day without any responsibilities seems like they’ve straight-up won life. Most of us have to work for that privilege or be born with a trust fund in our name. Only losing side to this path is a lack of romance or intimacy. No one’s likely gonna remember you anyway, for better or worse. Might as well enjoy your time on Earth with some of the most immersive storytelling humanity has invente…

In my experience[0] that's not really true. This comment[1] is pretty on the money. Being a NEET is not a vacation, and playing video games all day is often a means of avoiding confronting the realization that you're a waste of oxygen. Many have substance co-dependencies that function similarly. It's the sort of life that sounds cool as an overworked wagie but gets stale rather quickly, plus a massive helping of sunk…

And spending your life working to make other execs rich isn’t a waste of oxygen?
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