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Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

economist.com

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Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#591

Post by JumpCrisscross »

pasabagi wrote: post #589
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the entire EU economy grew at the same speed than the US one but not its 500 bigger companies This is literally the article’s point. Europe and the U.S. grew similarly. The U.S. and China produced more large companies. (The Continent’s larger companies also being older than the other two’s.) > supposedly more investment in R&D Not supposedly, factually. The article explicitly states this. It’s the Economist; if you…

> It’s the Economist; if you need a source, they’re available on Google Scholar. For the record, I don't know what Economist you've been reading, but the Economist I know is about as factually accurate as most media publications (that is, not particularly). Not to mention, even if this was an article written by an academic expert in the field, a source would be basic table stakes.

> the Economist I know is about as factually accurate as most media publications

We agree. I meant that an article appearing in the Economist doesn't need to source every detail, particularly when it's a widely-accessible and well-known statistic.

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#593

Post by midasuni »

StreamBright wrote: post #432
kpmah wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NHS is one of the most efficient health systems in the world.

And? What is your point? The Dutch is also one of the best. Singapore too. You can bring examples pro contra for both types. I think the regulation that makes a healthcare good or bad, not that it is private or public. Many public healthcares are in Eastern Europe are bad. Some private healthcares are also bad. I still think that a combination of private and public offering is probably the best with regulation being…

Holland spends 20% more on health per capita than the Uk

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#594

Post by minipci1321 »

238475235243 wrote: post #43

I've lived in a few different parts of the EU, and couldn't imagine a worse idea than starting a company there (which I did, once). Starting is hard enough without the general negative attitudes, the government insanities, the insane taxes, the low work ethic, the 8 weeks of vacation every month (I exaggerate, slightly). And I was in one of the two best EU countries, God only knows how bad it is in Spain or Italy or…

You are of course entitled to your personal opinion, and sharing it is OK, but this:

> ... the low work ethic .. (I exaggerate, slightly).

is a very wide-sweeping generalization which insults many of us.

Why is it that, every time someone complains about "low work ethics", the underlying context is always "my employees don't want to spend mad hours working on my idea for the compensation I think should be fair for them"?

Work ethics goes both ways BTW, and your "glory to firing someone with less than six months notice" doesn't sit square with me. "firing" is terminating for serious misconduct, notice is not due. I assume you meant laying off for economical reasons. So you want exemplary work ethics from the employees, and then quickly get rid of them when you think you don't need them anymore, did I get that right?

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#595

Post by Applejinx »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #437
j_wtf_all_taken wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it nice that a large part of the European economy consists of stuff helping people (the "state activities" you mention) vs. the large part of the US economy that consists of hurting people?

US creating top paying tech jobs for the working class and not taxing them to death so they can grow into a flourishing middles class is also helping people. >large part of the US economy that consists of hurting people Source? If you're talking about the defense sector then you should also know that the UK and France were several years in a row number 2 and 3 worldwide in arms sales, including to the Saudi regime.

>top paying tech jobs for the working class

If you believe that, I'm not sure where to start. My own family put several kids into tech jobs one way or another, but sure didn't start from being working class.

As to not taxing working class people so they can turn into middle class people, boy are we not speaking the same language. For starters, you are probably talking about not taxing middle class people, by leaning MORE heavily on regressive taxation that cuts middle and upper class people a break so 'they can grow'. But that's a whole other story…

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#596

Post by j_wtf_all_taken »

simonh wrote: post #555
j_wtf_all_taken wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> the entire EU economy grew at the same speed than the US one but not its 500 bigger companies > This is literally the article’s point. Europe and the U.S. grew similarly. The U.S. and China produced more large companies. (The Continent’s larger companies also being older than the other two’s.) So Europe did a better job in distributing wealth more equally, while in the US and China you got a massive concentration…

That's about the distribution of economic activity between large and small businesses. It's got nothing to do with wealth distribution between individuals. All that the Economist is pointing out is that there are some businesses in which you have to have massive scale to be competitive. In those specific businesses, you either scale up or you can't compete at all. Europe is giving up competing in those areas.

Sounds like a really unhealthy market so maybe we should regulate that so this massive upscaling is not required?

Like enforcing interoperability between platforms, privacy rules etc.?

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#597

Post by crunchyfrog »

j_wtf_all_taken wrote: post #568
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #562

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Environment-polluting industry? Like VW's cheating diesel engines who's emissions I have to breathe as I walk/bike to work? >Social media giants? Nobody forces you to use those social media giants whereas I can't choose to only breathe only air not contaminated by VW diesel emissions.

Yeah but at least we have those rules that VW could then break. And the negative effects of social media affect me if I use it or not.

The US's EPA discovered the cheating and leveled multi-billion dollar fines and indicted executives.

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#598

Post by kawsper »

jopsen wrote: post #527
thow-01187 wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imho, what was happening in the Silicon Valley economy looks much more like displacement of value rather than creation of value (1). Google/Facebook have displaced other ad formats, redirecting money to themselves. AWS have displaced IT technicians in other corporations, redirecting money to themselves. Apple is selling overpriced commodity hardware, redirecting money to themselves. Uber is displacing taxis, redirect…

> Uber is displacing taxis, redirecting money to themselves. I lived in San Francisco 2013-2018, before Uber I very rarely used taxis -- to/from the airport maybe. Having moved back to Denmark, I again very rarely use taxis. But when I lived in the US, I used Uber many times each week. Sometimes to/from work. But taxis in Denmark is easily 5x as expensive, and generally unavailable on-demand. So now I was forced to b…

Have you tried using Moove? It's the same on-demand concept of Uber, but it's Dantaxi that are behind it with certified taxi drivers: https://moove.taxi

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#599

Post by jusssi »

emptysongglass wrote: post #160
robocat wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't buy that argument. As I increase my earnings, more and more is disposable income (beyond the costs of living for my social status). Extra dollars go towards things you want, not the things you need, so there is quite an incentive to earn more even if it is highly taxed. As you raise your income,

Anecdata from myself here but I've recently hit top tax in Denmark. I'm ambitious but have started to feel like it's just not worth it scrabbling for an extra 2 or 3k a month when most of it disappears down the end of a hoover. I don't even know how millionaires who can afford their incredible estates in the countryside do it. My first thought was tax havens but I don't know if that's true. It seems like the entire s…

Capitalism 101: you won't get there with your own work. You get there by installing yourself in a position where you take a cut out of work of others, then scale it up.

Re: Europe is now a corporate also-ran. Can it recover its footing?

#600

Post by j_wtf_all_taken »

Applejinx wrote: post #585
simonh wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's about the distribution of economic activity between large and small businesses. It's got nothing to do with wealth distribution between individuals. All that the Economist is pointing out is that there are some businesses in which you have to have massive scale to be competitive. In those specific businesses, you either scale up or you can't compete at all. Europe is giving up competing in those areas.

Competitive is not the same thing as innovative. Innovative is the real disruptor. We forget this at our peril.

Comletition leads to innovation for all while monopolies lead to stagnation or degeneration with a few benificiaries.
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