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Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

reuters.com

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Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#131

Post by jlokier »

makomk wrote: post #104
fwip wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but you've got to look at the absolute rate, which in this case is 283 out of 12 million, which is roughly 24 people per million. You can look at the risk of what it's preventing (covid has already killed ~1700 people per million in the US), or compare to other activities and risk levels. Relative risk comparisons between different activities are often not useful. For example, the risk of shark-death at the be…

The trouble is that the people apparently at risk from this are not the people at risk from Covid-19. The risk to people between the ages of 12 and 24 from Covid is really, really small. Especially towards the lower end of that age range, most countries seem to be seeing low single-digit per million deaths: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4...

The risk of death from Covid-19 is low in that age range.

But what about the risk of heart inflammation from Covid-19 in that age group, possibly with no other Covid symptoms?

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#132

Post by lame-robot-hoax »

osipov wrote: post #58
lame-robot-hoax wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but the route in which a vaccination takes place (IM injection into deltoid) should mean that much much less of the spike protein ends up in the heart and lungs vs a natural infection. As well, the overall amount of spike protein in the body will be less. https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2021/05/04/sp... “Consider what happens when you’re infected by the actual coronavirus. We know now that the hug…

>The injection is intramuscular, not into the bloodstream. Recent research (per No Agenda shownotes) showed that unlike traditional vaccines, Moderna mRNA spread through the bloodstream producing and distributing spike protein in the entire body.

What do you mean by “spread through the bloodstream”?

Of course even in an IM injection, some will end up in the blood stream. The better question is the overall amount that stays within the deltoid vs that that travels elsewhere, and how the compares to natural infection. How does the virus deposit itself around the body vs. how does the spike protein via vaccination deposit itself around the body. As well, with the way the vaccine works, once it hits a cell, that cell will express the spike protein to the surface and that’s it, instead of contributing to further viral spread in the same region.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#133

Post by gulli1010 »

gulli1010 wrote: post #130
mrfusion wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COVID induced myocarditis has been thoroughly disproven: https://www.statnews.com/2021/05/14/setting-the-record-strai...

COVID is still an unfolding disaster. I doubt that anybody really understands completely what it does.

I have also been experiencing irregular heart beat and palpitations. Quite possible that I had COVID at some point.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#134

Post by smhenderson »

mypalmike wrote: post #115
smhenderson wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

given that the frontline practitioners are actively discouraging any patients from making a connection for adverse reactions with the vaccine? Do you have a source for this? As another poster replied, I was encouraged to report symptoms and given a packet with information on what to look out for, what to report and a website to do so. Same with my wife and two adult children.

I was also encouraged to report symptoms (or lack thereof) through a website. Unfortunately the website was thoroughly broken and I was unable to do so.

I'll admit I did not even attempt to report anything. I didn't have any meaningful symptoms after my first shot (Moderna) and the symptoms I had after the second were pretty bad but also everything I expected based on what I heard from others. Chills, muscle aches, typical flu-like symptoms that lasted just about 24 hours.

So I can't speak to the quality of any websites. But I do not recall anyone before the parent comment saying they were actively discouraged by health workers to not report symptoms.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#135

Post by Workaccount2 »

breadzeppelin__ wrote: post #89
splithalf wrote: post #44

We’ve known this for a month or so. The bottom line is that experts still recommend getting the vaccine.

meanwhile the many experts who don't recommend it are widely and very vocally shunned as 'science deniers'. Andddd downvoted. Cant even point out that there are actual experts on both sides of the argument without people being upset about it.

I'm pretty sure you can still dig up climate scientists that deny global warming.

Playing the "both sides" argument implies a coin or card, where both sides are equal. In reality this argument is played by people who know their side is dwarfed but want to project legitimacy.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#136

Post by motohagiography »

lame-robot-hoax wrote: post #39
newsclues wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spike protein causes cellular damage, doesn’t matter if it comes from the vaccine or virus

Yes, but the route in which a vaccination takes place (IM injection into deltoid) should mean that much much less of the spike protein ends up in the heart and lungs vs a natural infection. As well, the overall amount of spike protein in the body will be less. https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2021/05/04/sp... “Consider what happens when you’re infected by the actual coronavirus. We know now that the hug…

Does that imply that the difference in hitting a vein with the injection vs. staying intramuscular would be where in the body the protein travels to and causes an immune response?

Nothing is ever that simple, but of cases with effects consistent with the protein being in the blood stream with consequences to the heart and brain, if that were a factor, it would be both testable and avoidable, and provide the explanation people would need to choose to get the shot. If the odds of accidentally hitting a vein and the bloodstream consequences as described lined up, it could move the issue forward.

I have zero expertise in this area, my interest in asking is what would make a more compelling case for getting more people immune, and having a straightforward explanation for the causes of the prior reports of harm would go a long way toward that goal.

Put another way: would injecting directly into an artery or vein have risks that the intramuscular jab would not - and do those risks resemble the anecdotal reports of myo, clots, and deaths?

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#137

Post by lootsauce »

newsclues wrote: post #87
VoiceOfWisdom wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its in testing right now.

I’m listening to the livestream on Bret Weinstein’s channel and they are discussing data that states the opposite including data that shows a concentration in the ovaries.

is this it? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn_b4NRTB6k

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#138

Post by eckesicle »

Kognito wrote: post #86
mrfusion wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COVID induced myocarditis has been thoroughly disproven: https://www.statnews.com/2021/05/14/setting-the-record-strai...

Thanks for the article, an interesting read for sure. It’s nice to see there’s been plenty of follow-up study on this. Respectfully, you’re wrong to say “thoroughly disproven”. Even the article ends with the suggestion that it’s a side-effect of covid, albeit a rare one. The article’s position is more that it was overblown to worry about stopping young athletes from competing for fear of myo being a common side-effec…

My wife died from myocarditis 2 months ago. The only thing she tested positive for was COVID.

The coroner's report however, was quite clear that COVID did not cause her death or the myocarditis and that there has been no such reported case anywhere in the world.

If anyone has information to dispute that I would be very interested to see it. Thanks

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#139

Post by Mountain_Skies »

EMM_386 wrote: post #54
Kognito wrote: post #25

Very interesting given one of the lesser known complications of covid can be myocarditis in otherwise healthy individuals with few or no other covid symptoms. In fact, it’s likely the incidence of covid-induced myocarditis is vastly underreported given it often shows no symptoms and can only reasonably be diagnosed with a cardiac MRI which is not always widely available or advised for less-serious heart conditions. I…

The human heart has a lot of ACE2 receptors, which is what Covid binds to. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7239191/ I wonder if you can get myocarditits both from exposure and the vaccine. Covid is in your heart tissue, triggering an immune response. When you get the vaccine, your immune system is going to ramp up even further to deal with this Covid in your heart. This would only affect people who had p…

Wonder if this will lead to an increase in pericarditis over the next couple of years. I had pericarditis when I was a teen. The explanation from the cardiologist, which probably was dumbed down for me, was that sometimes a foreign body like bacteria or a virus gets hidden in the lining of the heart and when it later gets exposed to the immune system, it causes the pericardium to get enflamed, which squeezes the heart. How long do spike proteins (SARS-CoV-2 or vaccine created) hang out if they make it to the heart? We probably don't know yet.
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