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There are no results for tank man

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Re: There are no results for tank man

#311

Microsoft says it was due to an accidental human error. https://twitter.com/josephfcox/status/1400913178125553665?s=...

Right of course is.

Yet 'another accident' on the anniversary of the crackdowns of the Tiananmen Square protests. /s

Re: There are no results for tank man

#312
post #45

@dang, I think we need an explanation for why Tank Man-related content on Hacker News has been disappearing all day. I usually trust HN to be a bastion of free speech, and if there isn't some kind of proportionate response here, I don't believe myself or many others here will be able to see it that way going forward. EDIT: Thank you for your response, dang. Hacker News is a special place, which is why we have respond…

[deleted]

Re: There are no results for tank man

#313
post #72
post #45

@dang, I think we need an explanation for why Tank Man-related content on Hacker News has been disappearing all day. I usually trust HN to be a bastion of free speech, and if there isn't some kind of proportionate response here, I don't believe myself or many others here will be able to see it that way going forward. EDIT: Thank you for your response, dang. Hacker News is a special place, which is why we have respond…

This post is on the front page right now (edit: and now also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27396783 ) - that's the opposite of "disappearing". I'd have to see links to the other ones. Here's one tip for you guys, from years-long, world-weary experience: if you're coming up with sensational explanations in breathless excitement, it's almost certainly untrue. Edit: ok, here's what happened. Users flagged https:/…

As it is too late to edit my comment, I wanted to write this here, rather than sending a private email, dang.

I apologize if the questions of myself and other users on this site today has set you on edge - and I am sure that today, in public and in private, you have seen many ugly things that the majority of us do not, and you reasonably draw a trend-line. I believe that you should extend the same charity of trend-spotting in the other direction.

We live in tumultuous times, and the speed at which the ratchet is moving seems to be ever-increasing. There are significant concerns, as I know you know, about censorship abroad, and also at home in various western countries. I believe the overwhelming outpouring you have seen today has been in response to one undeniable fact -- that even a genuine accident on the part of some engineer somewhere could apply CCP (or any country's ruling party) censorship globally is a line in the sand that many did not realize had been already been crossed.

Whether accidental or intentional, this is a watershed moment in the debate over censorship and freedom. It seems likely there are many more such errors in configuration actively deployed right now. That we have no way of knowing what, or how many such incidents there are is an existential threat to non-authoritarian systems of governance across the globe.

To see something that seemed unthinkable even a few months ago - that Tank Man could be censored in western countries on the anniversary in remembrance of the struggles he literally stood for - crossed a threshold for me in terms of what I believed could be possible more broadly. To see the extremely reasonable discussion around it disappear from hacker news, and stay dead for hours (I note that both the inappropriately-flagged article and the accidentally-marked-as-dupe article both still maintain those statuses at the time of this writing [EDIT: The flagged article's status was changed a few minutes after. Thank you, dang. Doing so does not mean you are re-writing history, and we appreciate it]) made it feel like it had encroached even closer to home than I had suspected.

It made it feel like perhaps I'd been even more naive than I had ever imagined. I'm sure you must feel the same way, after some of the more hateful things I'm sure you heard today.

All of this is to say that I treasure the community that you have played the single largest role in shaping, and your explanations have completely satisfied me.

I apologize for the way your day turned out, and any negative ways in which I have contributed towards that.

Re: There are no results for tank man

#314

Since these pages will likely be updated, here are the archived links as proof of this happening: https://web.archive.org/web/20210604192821/https://www.bing.... https://web.archive.org/web/20210604180506/https://images.se... https://web.archive.org/web/20210604194355/https://www.ecosi... https://web.archive.org/web/20210604194336/https://search.ao... Some people probably think "nobody uses Bing", but Bing powers a l…

It seems like their safe search is hiding even search results for other related search terms. I am not sure how they were moderated to be not safe. https://archive.is/KOTNB

I hope Microsoft has a good write up on how this happened, both on the search term blanket ban and the safe search results thing.

Re: There are no results for tank man

#315
post #311

Microsoft says it was due to an accidental human error. https://twitter.com/josephfcox/status/1400913178125553665?s=...

Right of course is. Yet 'another accident' on the anniversary of the crackdowns of the Tiananmen Square protests. /s

I’m not sure what you’re trying to imply. The fact that it’s the anniversary would easily explain why they’re making sure it’s censored properly in China, the human error is that it’s being censored outside of China.

Re: There are no results for tank man

#316
post #46

I'm guessing it is a "hand tuned" search result tweak because just appending "china" returns a few images: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=tank%20man%20china (For those who don't see results, this is my screen grab of the above at 18:12 UTC : https://imgur.com/a/3tzPV49 ) Also, "Tiananmen Square massacre" still returns some image results: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Tiananmen+Square+massac... Therefore,…

"6 4 incident" returns meaningful results on Duck Duck Go and Google, but nothing on Microsoft Bing.

Re: There are no results for tank man

#318
post #309

As discussed extensively in the Bing thread [0] comments, this is because DDG uses Bing’s search index. Microsoft has acknowledged this is in error...[1] (though the error seems to be that censorship meant to just apply to China is being applied everywhere) [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27395635 [1] https://www.vice.com/en/article/qj8v9m/bing-censors-tank-man

I didn't know DDG uses Bing's search index. What exactly is their value proposition over Bing then?

Re: There are no results for tank man

#319
post #311

Microsoft says it was due to an accidental human error. https://twitter.com/josephfcox/status/1400913178125553665?s=...

Right of course is. Yet 'another accident' on the anniversary of the crackdowns of the Tiananmen Square protests. /s

Please see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27397695 about degrees of freedom and Von Neumann elephants. I have no knowledge of what's going on at MS, but it is a complex enough system to generate endless datapoints. What makes them significant is that we pick the ones to single out as meaningful. (Edit: by "we" I mean anyone, of course.)

To be clear, I don't care about $BigCo, only HN; and if there's any actual evidence that this whole thing was anything other than randomness playing its usual tricks on the hivemind, that would actually be interesting and on-topic for HN. But note those words "actual" and "evidence".

Re: There are no results for tank man

#320
post #46

I'm guessing it is a "hand tuned" search result tweak because just appending "china" returns a few images: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=tank%20man%20china (For those who don't see results, this is my screen grab of the above at 18:12 UTC : https://imgur.com/a/3tzPV49 ) Also, "Tiananmen Square massacre" still returns some image results: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Tiananmen+Square+massac... Therefore,…

Turning safe search off also returns results more like you'd expect, though a bunch of those images are blanked out even then.
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