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My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

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Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#561

Post by ALittleLight »

toast0 wrote: post #512
ALittleLight wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't your set of statistics show that rape accusations are 2-8 times as likely to be proven false as they are to be proven true?

Rape is hard to prove. If one party claims consent was obtained and the other that it wasn't, and there is no recording, it's going to be difficult to make a finding of fact based on the testimony of the two parties. In the absence of clear evidence of lack of consent, with no further evidence, I would expect most cases to result in a finding of not-guilty or not to ever result in a charge. Think about what evidence…

Sure but the statistics, 1% of reported rapes lead to conviction and 2-8% are shown to be false, do not support the conclusion that false report of rape is not a big issue.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#562

Post by voces »

GavinMcG wrote: post #539
voces wrote: post #519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Want to hook up again later? > I am not in the mood right now, no. > Are you sure? What happened after? Rape with her shutting down as a robot? Maybe she even cried during the sex, but he just would not stop? I am getting all these crazy unsavory visions, that could have been stopped had she poked her attacker's eye or broke his pinky finger or went to the police the next morning or something.

This is the definition of victim-blaming. You are going to lengths to imagine a way she is at fault.

I don't even think she is at fault, and I do feel for her. From what I gather she was the victim of some extremely shady and uncouth man, who did make sure he didn't do anything illegal.

It is not going to lengths: just a few percent chance it was something more innocuous like that (or someone terribly regretting they did not forcefully say "no", so in their mind they said their thoughts out loud), and it would demand pause in our severe and career-ending charges of rape.

This Medium post is not enough. Netto, its contribution is negative, because it welcomes one-sided speculation, and paints the entire Scala community with that same brush.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#563

Post by DaveExeter »

ummonk wrote: post #455
DaveExeter wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you did a little research you will find they got paid $41,000,000 by the City of New York! You think the City just handed over tens of millions of dollars because settling would be cheaper then going to trial?

The criteria for such a civil suit is whether the defendants' civil rights were violated, not whether the defendants are guilty. And cities often settle lawsuits regardless of guilt to avoid the costs of going to trial as well as the risks of public backlash. Notably in this specific case, the decision to settle was a political decision after DeBlasio was elected mayor.

The City of New York is very wealthy, but you don't get almost $10 million for having your civil rights violated!

I assure you, if that was the case, there would be a lot more multi-millionaires in NYC because the local police play it pretty fast 'n loose with the civil rights of citizens.

And again, the City didn't hand over forty-million to get rid of a nuisance lawsuit. They have lawyers on staff -- it would probably cost under a million dollars for the city to go to trial.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#564

Post by that_guy_iain »

ie21 wrote: post #552
that_guy_iain wrote: post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What world are you living in? Sexual predators even when there has been proof (and sometimes they‘ve admitted) it often get away with to little to no punishment.

What about those cases when they don't get away? How is that established? Hearsay?

That doesn’t validate the claim that when there is proof only one story is needed. It’s a fact that one story with proof isn’t always enough.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#565

Post by btilly »

baobabKoodaa wrote: post #332
btilly wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only kind of agree. In this case a Chinese woman living in the USA apparently got raped in Germany 3 years ago. To involve law enforcement she would have to travel to a country where she doesn't speak the language, to make an accusation for which she has no evidence but her word, against a man who lives in another city. What, exactly, do you imagine that the police are likely to do with her report? I hate the court…

> raped I agree with everything else in your post except for the description of events as "rape". According to the story she wrote, they had sex when she was drunk, and she thought for months after the fact that the sex had been consensual. To me it sounds like sexual abuse / exploitation, not rape. (Unless you're making the pedantic argument that having sex with an intoxicated person is always rape, in which case 2…

According to the story they had sex while drunk. But then he kept on having sex with her, including when she was saying that she didn't want him to.

It is rape to have sex with a woman who didn't want it and told you not to. She describes exactly that happening later in the conference. Yes, she tried to convince herself that it was consensual. And he tried to convince her of the same. But that is also a common pattern for rape, both her attempt to deny it and his to gaslight her.

Interestingly in surveys, the portion of women who describe having had an encounter meeting the definition of rape has held fairly steady over the decades. But the portion of women who self-describe that as rape has steadily risen. Then really jumped in 2018. Given that fact I find it interesting that he seems to target women from cultures that haven't internalized "no means no" as a standard. Cultures where it is easier for the man to do what he wants, then convince her that he didn't rape her.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#566

Post by throwaway0a5e »

Pfhreak wrote: post #556
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #550

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>enthusiastic and unambiguous By redefining consent you've just redefined rape to include some large percentage of people in stable relationships. If everyone's a rapist nobody is.

If you are having sex and your partner isn't unambiguously interested, you need to ask yourself some questions. Also, people in stable relationships can have non consensual sex. It was legal to rape your wife until like the 90s in parts of the states.

People have agency. They're allowed to choose, of their own free will, to do things they aren't 100% on board with. That includes sex.

Blowing your husband because it wastes less of your time then him trying to woo you or popping a Viagra because your wife is hitting the bong and you know what she's gonna want next aren't ideal but they're facts of some peoples lives.

There's no way you can honestly allege those sorts of things are rape. So how do you justify your redefinition of consent?

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#567

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #533

General PSA from someone who has studied such things: 1. Alcohol is the number one date rape drug and it's problematic in part because men tend to have a much higher tolerance than women. 2. Date rape frequently involves two people from different cultures with different social expectations. This often fosters terrible misunderstandings. 3. It's always problematic to "try a case" in the court of public opinion. Probab…

I continue to appreciate your appraisals and summaries, thank you.

Your comments on tricky topics tend to lean more toward actionables, rather than the perpetual rehashing same arguments the rest of this comment section is filled with.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#568

Post by ie21 »

that_guy_iain wrote: post #564
ie21 wrote: post #552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about those cases when they don't get away? How is that established? Hearsay?

That doesn’t validate the claim that when there is proof only one story is needed. It’s a fact that one story with proof isn’t always enough.

Perhaps more facts surface in this case.

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#569

Post by colecut »

oh_sigh wrote: post #484
colecut wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"What if a bunch of your ex-girlfriends or ex-boyfriends got together and decided to ruin your life with accusations?" This just pretty much does not happen without reason, and I think it is safe to say that if it did, you are probably a terrible person.

People don't go to jail without reason. Therefore everyone in jail is guilty.

Nice stretch

Re: My experience with sexual harassment in the Scala community

#570

Post by filoleg »

ummonk wrote: post #448
DonHopkins wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Almost certainly guilty," huh? Citations please? Are you talking about a DIFFERENT "Central Park Five" than the ones who were exonerated? Or are you just ironically quoting Trump? Do you agree with him that hate is what we need if we're gonna get something done? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Park_jogger_case >From the outset the case was a topic of national interest, with the commentary on social issues evol…

Good that you linked the Wikipedia article. It has a good description of the case: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Park_jogger_case#Armst... "In its January 2003 Armstrong Report, the panel "did not dispute the legal necessity of setting aside the convictions of the five defendants based on the new DNA evidence that Mr. Reyes had raped the jogger."[103] But it disputed acceptance of Reyes's claim that he alone…

That quote about "nothing but his uncorroborated word" regarding Reyes acting alone isn't the established truth, despite Armstrong Report saying it, wikipedia listed it just to demonstrate the opinion that Armstrong Report held.

Check these two quotes from the same wikipedia page[0]:

>In addition, his [Reyes's] DNA matched the DNA evidence at the scene, confirming that he was the sole source of the semen found in and on the victim "to a factor of one in 6,000,000,000 people".

>DNA analysis of the strands of hair found on the clothing of two of the defendants, conducted with advanced technology not available at the time of their trial, established that the hair did not belong to the victim, despite what the prosecution had testified to at trial

The second one circumstantially supports that the defendants weren't involved, but the first one pretty much proves that the defendants weren't at the scene. Unless you want to claim that the defendants fully sanitized the victim after they assaulted her, leaving no traces of their DNA on or inside of her. I haven't heard that being claimed anywhere on the wikipedia page though.

0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Park_jogger_case#Assai...

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