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Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#51

Post by foerbert »

nwienert wrote: post #45
mkoubaa wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah why not cauliflower

Okinawa diet is some 40% sweet potatoes and top percentile life span so can’t hurt.

Sure it could. You can't just isolate some portion of a highly complex system and claim that the isolated portion will be beneficial in any similar system.

Just for an extreme example to make the point - say some diet included a poisonous component as well as the antidote. Those eating the diet may well be just fine. However if somebody else simply looked at the poisonous part and copied only that, they would not do so well.

I'm not saying sweet potatoes are bad. And I'm sure this was a somewhat flippant statement, but this is the kind of thinking we're very prone to and I think it's important to recognize when it actually tries to lead us down the wrong path.

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#52

Post by NotSammyHagar »

imwillofficial wrote: post #42
NotSammyHagar wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on, don't use the word clean with regards to diet. It's a bs and meaningless word that specifies nothing. Is it no sugar, no salt, no meat, no gc organisms, no alcohol no processed, low carb, high carb? Clean is a word that suggests Instagram influencers. Clean does not mean bland or not bland, whole foods or not. It's a meaningless word like good, healthy, natural.

Subjective meaning is not no meaning. Good absolutely has a meaning. So does healthy, as does natural. Your lack of understanding of the context of use, and underlying meaning, is nobody's problem but your own. Perhaps you should have asked what He meant by clean, because clearly you don't understand.

what does clean mean to you then? Everything we consume has been modified from the original. Apples, wheat, tomatoes, corn - everything we eat has been significantly modified from what it was 10,000 years ago. Early farmers modified potatoes and everything else to grow more calories by genetic manipulation - like planting the ones that grow faster or bigger. Nothing and I mean nothing is like it was before mankind started eating it. We put selective breeding pressure on cows by breeding the ones we grow. I can make up a definition of clean but everyone has a sense of it themselves. Whole foods that are not significantly modified seems reasonable. But modified from what?

https://www.primalorganicmiami.com/eat-clean-miami/ As this website says "There is not a strict definition for “eating clean”. I still assert clean eating is meaningless.

I'm not against healthy eating. But "healthy eating" or "clean foods" don't have definitions.

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#53

Post by NotSammyHagar »

legerdemain wrote: post #5
jbritton wrote: post #4

How do you measure inflammation?

Serum concentration of C-reactive protein and other molecular markers of ongoing inflammation processes.

You made a lot of good comments on this article, do you have a background in nutrition?

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#54

Post by rorykoehler »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #35
kossTKR wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here. It's the closest thing to an actual wonder drug i have ever come across. My skin clears up, brainfog disappears, the white in my eyes get brighter, etc. After reading a bit i have come to the same conclusion - if your diet is already extremely clean / bland, maybe you won't get the same effect, but for most people that eats lots of different foods, processed stuff, fast food, alcohol, harsh additives, frie…

If I could make it past the first 24 hours of fasting I could probably go further, but I get really bad headaches when fasting and usually give up somewhere close to 24 hours. I hear that if I were to push through for a few more hours that the headache would clear up, but haven't been able to do that yet.

The headaches could be due to electrolyte imbalance. Are you taking 4g potassium-citrate and 300mg magnesium-citrate a day when you fast? If not that could solve your headaches.

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#55

Post by pengaru »

gadf wrote: post #39
asadkn wrote: post #14

Most people talk food when inflammation is mentioned. But let's not forget, arguably, an even bigger contributor: stress - mental or physical, say via a chronic illness. Relevant: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5476783/#s2titl...

Take aspirin daily forever, if your stomach hurts, stop. Start again.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-heart-aspirin/with...

https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704511304575075...

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/aug/03/painkillers-...

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/18/health/aspirin-health.htm...

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/09/16/6474154...

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#56

Post by sparrc »

johnisgood wrote: post #41
sparrc wrote: post #26

It's always strange to me how certain studies seem to gain so many upvotes on hackernews....a few thoughts: 1. This is a single study published in 2015, what does the wider literature say? Any dieticians or clinicians recommending anything from this? 2. The journal is EBioMedicine, which is not nothing but not exactly pre-eminent either. 3. This seems like just a common sense conclusion: "In Cox proportional hazard m…

I suppose emphasis is on this: "telomere length was not a predictor of successful ageing".

yet everyone in the comments is sounding off as if this scientifically proves their random anecdotes about fasting

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#57

Post by [deleted] »

foerbert wrote: post #51
nwienert wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okinawa diet is some 40% sweet potatoes and top percentile life span so can’t hurt.

Sure it could. You can't just isolate some portion of a highly complex system and claim that the isolated portion will be beneficial in any similar system. Just for an extreme example to make the point - say some diet included a poisonous component as well as the antidote. Those eating the diet may well be just fine. However if somebody else simply looked at the poisonous part and copied only that, they would not do…

[deleted]

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#58

Post by throwaway_isms »

andreygrehov wrote: post #38
asadkn wrote: post #14

Most people talk food when inflammation is mentioned. But let's not forget, arguably, an even bigger contributor: stress - mental or physical, say via a chronic illness. Relevant: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5476783/#s2titl...

Curious – are there legitimate ways to measure stress?

cortisol levels can be tested

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#59

Post by rsync »

legerdemain wrote: post #7
TimSchumann wrote: post #3

Anecdote, but this may explain why I feel so much healthier when I'm fasting regularly. Turns out, if you stop putting everything but water/salt in your body, there's not much left that causes inflammation.

Inflammation is a basic life process, not a reaction to the food you eat. Inflammation plays an active part in wound-healing. Teething in infants has an inflammatory component. Systemic inflammation is ubiquitous during and following parturition in mammals. There is inflammation everywhere, it's as generic a word as "oxidation" and "metabolism."

"Inflammation is a basic life process, not a reaction to the food you eat. Inflammation plays an active part in wound-healing. Teething in infants has an inflammatory component. Systemic inflammation is ubiquitous during and following parturition in mammals. There is inflammation everywhere, it's as generic a word as "oxidation" and "metabolism.""

Everything you have said is true.

What I think you are missing is that there is both a per-calorie inflammation cost for all food inputs and a minimum inflammatory startup cost just to metabolize at all.

More simply: 1000 calories spread across two meals will generate more inflammation than 1000 calories in a single meal.

There are two analogies that I think are useful when thinking about this:

First, introducing food inputs appears to be an interrupt for most other bodily activities - even very essential ones like sleep and reproduction, etc. You might consider how many hours each day your body spends not digesting. It doesn't take much to increase that by 50% or more...

Second, electric motors like pumps and fans have failures ("deaths") that are much more accurately predicted by number of start-stop cycles than by the number of hours run. Startup is expensive for these devices and I suspect that startup is expensive for our food metabolism as well.

Re: Inflammation, but Not Telomere Length, Predicts Ageing at Extreme Old Age

#60

Post by pazimzadeh »

mrwaffle wrote: post #28

hi, i'm a just stupid waffle. can someone give me the TLDR of this [nearly] impossible to understand piece of writing?

> We conclude that inflammation is an important malleable driver of ageing up to extreme old age in humans
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