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WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

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Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#191

Post by red_trumpet »

alpaca128 wrote: post #188
techrat wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "no one is there" will start becoming not true, even if not immediately. Still waiting for that to be the case. After 6 years of using Signal, I have a whopping... two... people in my contacts who also use it. The most common response is still "Why don't you just use Whatsapp?" Pretty much the only way we're going to see critical mass with Signal is if someone like Google were to make it their default platform for…

I got my parents to install Signal a while ago, now in the recent 2-3 months their Signal contact lists have at least doubled when Signal got an unexpected boost by WhatsApp's privacy PR nightmare. I don't expect things to change much, though. Because in the end normal users think about the functionality and price first, everything else second. Privacy? Just a neat-sounding bonus you can feel good about if your favor…

> Because in the end normal users think about the functionality and price first, everything else second.

I think the most important factor here is network effects.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#192

Post by theamk »

godelski wrote: post #34
nopato wrote: post #13

To be honest I feel a bit disenfranchised. I’ve used all my energy to convert all my friends to signal when the WhatsApp privacy policy fiasco happened and now they’re saying it was a waste of time since they don’t want anything to do with bitcoins.. I can’t blame them as I also don’t want this on my messaging app. I feel like I will just give up and use WhatsApp and assume that I only had privacy pre-internet.

> they don’t want anything to do with bitcoins Honestly, this is a bad argument. You can use Signal and never send a gif or stickers. You don't have to do anything with ~~stickers~~crypto when using Signal. It is an opt-in feature that is probably going to not be used my 90% of people. This is just a bad argument surrounding the whole ordeal. Now the arguments about: regulations, Moxie's involvement (stated he has no…

I think it’s a valid argument. Once this is deployed everywhere, people will see the statements “Signal supports MOB” and “Signal has 20 million users” and make a conclusion, “20 million people can use MOB”. The only way to avoid being part of this statistic is to avoid the app.

In general, boycotting the product is the time-tested way to send messages to big corp. if you don’t like your clothes being made by child labor, don’t buy the brand. If you don’t like WhatsApp privacy policy, don’t install it. If you don’t like P&G spying on people in China, don’t buy their products. And if you don’t like cryptocurrencies, don’t use stuff from companies which support them.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#193

Post by slickdork »

theelous3 wrote: post #129
slickdork wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never heard of wire but it looks good, aside from the pricing. I'm hoping the future is a migration to a protocol such as Matrix, rather than users endlessly hoping from one product to another until they get sold out. https://matrix.org/

My friends and I did just that. I run us a federated self host. It's great. They aren't tech savvy - and no complaints.

I'm glad to hear the migration worked. I tried doing this but got stuck at the reverse proxy part, so my synapse instance was never accessible. It was likely user error, as it was my first attempt at using a reverse proxy. I'm going to move away from PFSense and try again.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#194

Post by erispoe »

Geee wrote: post #94
hudon wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, their opinion could be that Bitcoin is extremely wasteful and damaging to our environment for very little value, and so they do not want to support any organization that supports Bitcoin. A boycott, if you will. I’m not arguing that position but I’m just saying that if that is the case, then their boycott is more reasonable than say a “stickers” boycott.

They should educate themselves on why bitcoin is useful and why it's not wasteful, rather than ignore it based on false assumptions. This series of short articles is very good for those who want to learn the fundamentals: https://tomerstrolight.medium.com/why-bitcoin-the-series-660...

The argument in your link boils down to: it will bring the economy down to a deflationary halt, so it's friendly to the environment. Great.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#195

Post by Shmebulock »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #184
goldenchrome wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think non-nerds really think about privacy online all that much. This privacy catastrophe is only felt in places like HN.

Which is why privacy protection has to come from the top (i.e. regulators), because most people don't know and/or don't care. "we" care, up to the point of "it's too much effort", and "we" have tried to do a grassroots movement to get people to use more privacy-focused apps. But these apps, in the end, are still owned by companies who are not charities; they want to earn money, and digitally, it feels like you can on…

>Which is why privacy protection has to come from the top (i.e. regulators), because most people don't know and/or don't care.

I think there should only be legislation about stuff people care about.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#197

Post by skrebbel »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #190
matkoniecz wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is ApplePay associated with endless scams like ICO, extremely problematic security requiring extreme experience to avoid theft, massive transfer fees, lack of usability, endless scams and massive spam advertising such scam everywhere? And several other serious problems.

Have you stopped using cash? Think of all the drugs and organized crime that rely on it. You are being incredibly close-minded and only listing the cons of cryptocurrencies.

Nobody is being close-minded. I think you're mixing up "X is often associated with Y" and "X sucks because of Y". I don't think anybody in this thread is making the latter point particularly strongly.

The fact is that many people have negative associations with crypto. Even if they're wrong, it's still going to be bad marketing for Signal.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#198

Post by sneak »

rawfan wrote: post #150
sneak wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good thing then that there won't be any bitcoins in Signal.

https://signal.org/blog/update-on-beta-testing-payments/

Signal intends to use a cryptocurrency called Mobilecoin, not Bitcoin.

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#199

Post by dtx1 »

intrasight wrote: post #196

Honest question. What do Signal and WhatsApp bring to the table that I'm not getting with the messaging apps built into my phones? Me and all my friends and family just use those, and nobody has ever asked me to communicate with Signal or WhatsApp.

Do you mean Apps on your phone relying on SMS?

Re: WhatsApp's new privacy policy is so bad it might be illegal

#200

Post by f1refly »

jonplackett wrote: post #55
betwixthewires wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All centralized communications and social networking platforms will fall to pressure to sell at this point, if that wasn't their intention (this seems to be the exit strategy of most startups these days). The alternatives exist, but they don't have marketing budgets. They're things like jabber, matrix, Jami, and the many ActivityPub implementations out there. We have the alternatives already. We can use them now. To…

It's not me using it, it's all my friends and family that's the challenge. Whatsapp isn't just marketing, it was better than everything else by being super easy to use, required no sign up, looked just like text messaging so my parents liked it too. They did everything right (up until they sold it!).

Well, what makes you think that some new company would get any users then? Whatsapp requires sign in by the way. They take your phone number for that reason.
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