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Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

theintercept.com

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Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#101

Post by sterlind »

yongjik wrote: post #80
nullserver wrote: post #19

Israel is fighting for its existence. Iran leadership routinely makes threats to destroy America and Israel. This often get ignored or dismissed. But like waving a gun in a cops face. Well bad things happen. One nuke will piss America off. One nuke and Israel will just be gone, completely. Iran is probably capable of this, or close. From Israel standpoint the logical step is to bomb Iran military into the Stone Age.…

> One nuke and Israel will just be gone, completely. Iran is probably capable of this, or close. Area of Hiroshima: 350.1 square miles Area of Israel: 8,019 square miles Yeah I'd say [citation needed] for that. > From Israel standpoint the logical step is to bomb Iran military into the Stone Age. This really isn't helping you, because if you're an Iranian and your government says "That country over there says their o…

you can use more than one nuke. also, a Hiroshima-level blast on Tel Aviv would be pretty catastrophic even if it doesn't obliterate everything.

hydrogen bombs are where things really get scarier though.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#102

Post by jariel »

newacct583 wrote: post #86
nullserver wrote: post #19

Israel is fighting for its existence. Iran leadership routinely makes threats to destroy America and Israel. This often get ignored or dismissed. But like waving a gun in a cops face. Well bad things happen. One nuke will piss America off. One nuke and Israel will just be gone, completely. Iran is probably capable of this, or close. From Israel standpoint the logical step is to bomb Iran military into the Stone Age.…

If the US genuinely wanted to prevent Iranian weapons research, they wouldn't have simply walked away from the deal regulating it. The Trump administrations goals were complicated (and largely self-contradictory, and in most cases just poorly-informed), but they were not motivated by a practical desire to prevent proliferation. This is what everyone knew was going to happen. The interesting question is if "this" (an…

"they wouldn't have simply walked away from the deal regulating it."

The deal did not 'regulate' Iran - is the argument being made.

Many people feel that the oversight requirements were not stringent enough, and that Iran would effectively pursue nukes along with economic liberalism.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#103

Post by fasteddie31003 »

cptskippy wrote: post #71
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #66

Like them or not the Israeli Defense Force is arguably the most effective military in the world. From the Iron Dome, the Uzi, and the Arrow missile, the IDF has a track record of successful military projects. They seem lean and effective, unlike the US military. The US Military recently has had a track record of project failures from the F-35 to the Comanche helicopter and now they are spending $20B for Microsoft Hol…

The Uzi seems like an odd thing to brag about.

It's a pretty simple yet effective gun. Maybe the AK-47 of submachine guns.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#104

Post by akiselev »

marto1 wrote: post #73
monocasa wrote: post #6

This makes you wonder if we might see a resurgence in old school control systems without processors, and def no networks. The Manhattan project was able uranium purified to get a bomb working without PLCs and networks. All else being equal it's more expensive, but not compared to being unable to keep your network safe from attack. You need to reconfigure the line? Send eight techs down one by one to set new parameter…

In a lot of conflicts today the Kalashnikov is the highest tech used in combat so these simple systems are more the rule than the exception. High tech combat gear with VR and exoskeletons is more of a gun dealer's wet dream(e.g. costs a ton, breaks often) than anything that usually gets deployed.

The Kalashnikov looks low tech because it was designed to be cheap to manufacture but I'd argue the AK is one of the technical milestones in the 20th century on par with the assembly line (as horrible as the effects have been). It's carefully designed to operate reliably despite crappy manufacturing and ammunition tolerances after taking a beating in the field, made using whatever crappy metal is available for the receiver and barrel.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#105

Post by whimsicalism »

fastball wrote: post #76
gvv wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Life is hard when much of the world wants you dead. Well why is that?

Because people are anti-semitic. In this particular case, you have a muslim majority country on one side of the equation. In case you really need this much of a primer: (some) Muslims don't like Jews because they're following Muhammad's lead. Specifically, Muhammad had this to say about Jews in one of the Hadith: > The Day of Judgment will not come until Muslims fight the Jews, when the Jew will hide behind stones an…

I think it is hard to say that it is entirely anti-semitism and unrelated to what happened in Mandatory Palestine.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#106

Post by SilasX »

dragontamer wrote: post #12
monocasa wrote: post #6

This makes you wonder if we might see a resurgence in old school control systems without processors, and def no networks. The Manhattan project was able uranium purified to get a bomb working without PLCs and networks. All else being equal it's more expensive, but not compared to being unable to keep your network safe from attack. You need to reconfigure the line? Send eight techs down one by one to set new parameter…

> The Manhattan project was able uranium purified to get a bomb working without PLCs and networks. By enlisting thousands of young women to watch the knobs and dial buttons. https://outrider.org/nuclear-weapons/articles/women-who-buil... They didn't even know they were building the bomb. They just had to enter the room, dial knobs back-and-forth for 8-hours/day, and then go home. Today, that sort of stuff SHOULD be a…

Today, we've automated that with electronic computer chips, which also don't know the significance of what they're doing computations for.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#107

Post by rsstack »

tomjakubowski wrote: post #78
nullserver wrote: post #19

Israel is fighting for its existence. Iran leadership routinely makes threats to destroy America and Israel. This often get ignored or dismissed. But like waving a gun in a cops face. Well bad things happen. One nuke will piss America off. One nuke and Israel will just be gone, completely. Iran is probably capable of this, or close. From Israel standpoint the logical step is to bomb Iran military into the Stone Age.…

> One nuke and Israel will just be gone, completely. lolwut? Absolute nonsense. A 60kt nuke, size of the largest India has ever tested, wouldn't even dose like half of Tel-Aviv's land area, let alone the whole country. https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

This is a hilarious position to take. Israel should relax because losing 5% of its population (and another 5% due to later side effects), which includes most of its export and good portions of its youth, technically wouldn't destroy every part of the country.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#108

Post by astrea »

grenoire wrote: post #20
dragontamer wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Manhattan project was able uranium purified to get a bomb working without PLCs and networks. By enlisting thousands of young women to watch the knobs and dial buttons. https://outrider.org/nuclear-weapons/articles/women-who-buil... They didn't even know they were building the bomb. They just had to enter the room, dial knobs back-and-forth for 8-hours/day, and then go home. Today, that sort of stuff SHOULD be a…

Not without scheduled Instagram breaks you won't.

These are bold words coming from someone browsing HN during work hours (making massive timezone/ work schedule assumptions).

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#109

Post by setr »

V-2 wrote: post #74
avar wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The youth unemployment rate in Iran is ~25%, overall rate is 10%. They issue their own fiat currency, and their GDP per capita is comparable to Thailand and Botswana. So yes, they can probably afford to have a bunch of people tweak knobs in a factory all day.

Are you implying that if they were a richer, more prosperous country, then they couldn't afford it? I'm confused

If the job market is more saturated, there’s simply fewer people available to do bullshit work, at the necessary bullshit cost. Resources would be naturally allocated to more valuable efforts, and lured by better wages, by the market. As a general rule, the richer the country, the more expensive humans are, and the commodities become cheaper (relative to income)

In the US, I can’t afford a full time maid. In India, I could probably afford 10.

Or more pointedly, in the US you can afford a car far earlier than you can afford a maid. In India, it’s the opposite.

Re: Israel may have destroyed Iranian centrifuges simply by cutting power

#110

Post by yomansat »

nullserver wrote: post #19

Israel is fighting for its existence. Iran leadership routinely makes threats to destroy America and Israel. This often get ignored or dismissed. But like waving a gun in a cops face. Well bad things happen. One nuke will piss America off. One nuke and Israel will just be gone, completely. Iran is probably capable of this, or close. From Israel standpoint the logical step is to bomb Iran military into the Stone Age.…

I assume it's also jailing kids for peace, and stirring the hornet's nest doesn't sound very peaceful when there are peace talks coming up on the same subject.

They might have the better PR team, but for sure looking at actions rather than just words, it's clear who's the bad guy putting aside the whole typical "our ally" narrative.

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