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Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

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Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#151
The US government has gotten around its prohibition on “cruel and unusual punishment” in two ways. First, it outsourced the cruelty to private businesses, who are not prohibited in the same way. Second, in instances where it cannot be outsourced, they simply make their cruelty usual and commonplace, neatly skirting the requirement it be unusual.

The prison system is an example of both.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#152

I'm sure many people here have experienced frustration helping older relatives or friends use computers. Recently though, I realized, that computers are just way too hard to use. In our pursuit to avoid cryptic black screens with command prompts, a user must now understand that their computer has Windows with all of its menus and functions, a browser window with all of its menus and functions, running a webapp, with…

What a lot of people here don't get is that many people have zero interest in using a computer. They want to talk on the phone, order from Amazon, and play solitaire. That's pretty much the sum total of what my dad wants to use his computer/smartphone for.

He has absolutely zero interest in learning how file systems work, the intricacies of networks, or anything else about the underlying plumbing that allows him to do the things he wants to do.

I'd add that many of us have internalized how to use phones/tablets over time as they've become incrementally more complex. I still never remember all the details of having multiple windows open on a tablet given I don't use that functionality much and I periodically learn some trick I never knew about.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#153
post #48

Unpopular opinion: I think government services and offices should remain offline-first forever. They should offer online equivalents, but they should never assume or require digital adoption. I think this has two big benefits: - Minor point: Greater resilience to downtime, interruptions to service - Major point: a check on becoming a faceless entity with no exposure to the public. Think Google or FB if you get flagge…

> Unpopular opinion: I think government services and offices should remain offline-first forever. They should offer online equivalents, but they should never assume or require digital adoption. The converse is that the government should provide free internet access to all citizens and immigrants, IF that is the primary way to communicate with the govt. I also reject that "mail is an option" when mail takes 6-8 weeks…

Also there should be programs to re-integrate prisoners after incarceration, or just generally give them better access to be able to keep up with the outside world.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#154
post #18

Clearly wherever this is (US?) prisons are not about rehabilitation and inclusion back into society. Weren't there any classes? Books? Library? Computer rooms? It's complete failure of a justice system if person comes out of prison like from a time capsule. IMHO it may just increase recidivism - what can a person do in a "free" world if he/she were not let to know about the world outside prison walls?

It varies by state, region and facility. Don't forget that there are privately owned prisons in the US. Some programs do not allow you access to certain materials and when they do very likely may be old/outdated.

And of course...it just adds to their money if people reoffend.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#155
post #7

In contrast, I am sure we all know some older people who were not in prisson for the past 30 years and still don't know how to write an email, what a zoom call is or when it's appropriate to double-click vs single click items on a computer. I know people in their 50s who pretend that "they don't need this technology" or "I can just go to the bank if I need something". Sure, if you're in your 80s you might want to dod…

That rant, wow. It really resonates deeply with me. People would rather cumulatively spend some 10000 hours yelling at Office for the rest of their lives, instead of spending 10 over the course of some evenings/weekends to brush up on the basics. Even from an immediate-more-important-priorities-perspective it almost doesn’t make sense to me.

I think computer geeks tend not to recall how many hard-won insights and how much time it took for them to reach the point where learning "the basics" of MS Office would only take ten hours of study & practice. We think it's easy because we're building on decent-to-good mental models of how computers & software & networks operate.

Normal people don't have those, and every second of the thousands of hours it'd take to gain them would be miserable for them. Not everyone enjoys this crap. Most aren't born with the kind of good abstract and/or spatial reasoning abilities that makes this stuff relatively easy to figure out, either.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#156
post #39
post #18

Clearly wherever this is (US?) prisons are not about rehabilitation and inclusion back into society. Weren't there any classes? Books? Library? Computer rooms? It's complete failure of a justice system if person comes out of prison like from a time capsule. IMHO it may just increase recidivism - what can a person do in a "free" world if he/she were not let to know about the world outside prison walls?

>"IMHO it may just increase recidivism" Keeping people in prisons might be just what the US prison industrial complex wants.

Not sure why you got downvoted here. Private prisons are very much a thing in the US and in my state.

Not to mention the Federal prison Industries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Prison_Industries Revenue $531,453,000 (2019) "Under current law, all physically able inmates who are not a security risk or have a health exception are required to work, either for UNICOR or at some other prison job.[4][12] Inmates earn from US$0.23 per hour up to a maximum of US$1.15 per hour, and all inmates with court-ordered financial obligations must use at least 50% of this UNICOR income to satisfy those debts"

And that is just one of them...on the federal level...not state.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Government services are available offline or via phone as well The US Embassy FBU in London has recently switched to email only. They no longer accept postal mail. [1] The FBU handles social security related matters for those out of the country. You can visit in person only for urgent visits with an appointment which they point out are limited. [2] They no longer list a phone number of their site so appointments mu…

This seems to be the case for other embassies of other nations too (I am an expat). But I do get the feeling that if you have moved to another country then you probably are more able to access services online (buying the ticket to get there in the first place is a start) than some 90 year old 'back home' who's never left the village. I guess the flipside is your needs may be more complex (passport / family / citizens…

Landing in another country is one of the scenarios where you're most likely to be unable to access telecommunications. For example, you find your internet provider doesn't work internationally, you can't enable roaming without visiting their website, your phone isn't compatible with the local spectrum, your credit card gets fraud-flagged when you try to buy a local sim card because you forgot to tell Visa you'd be travelling, and you discover there's rules against paying in cash for a phone plan.

These are all just some of the things that can go wrong arriving in a foreign country!

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Budgeting using a tool like YNAB has allowed me to manage monthly funds more effectively, pay off debts faster, and save up more quickly for the things I want to buy. It's possible to use it by inputting all your receipts in manually but it's such a time sink. Automatic importing let's me see exactly where my funds are and budget quickly in a few minutes at the start of my day. When cards are not importing correctly…

That's good for you, but it sounds like you are spending way more time managing finances online, than I do offline ;) I have an average weekly budget that I keep track of in my head, and that's it. That's also the reason why I prefer paying in cash. Easier to keep track of the outgoing money.

In the US atleast if you're making cash payments you are subsidizing all credit card and debit card transactions. I end up at the end of the year with hundreds of dollars (often times over a thousand if I was awarded a bonus for a new card) returned back to me in cash back. If I convert to miles they are worth even more. I never use cash anywhere that accepts cards.

Online banking also makes it very easy to manage my cards to ensure I'm never paying interest since the first interest payment usually totally eats up any savings from cash back.

Re: Out of prison after 30 years and people telling him to find forms on the web

#159
If this person can learn all this so fast then our parents who ask how to put a file in an email or change their TV's input source for the 50th time, not making any attempt to retain the information because they know we'll be their crutch, have zero excuse. It's disgusting. Good on this guy.
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