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UK to depart from GDPR

lawgazette.co.uk

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Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#251

Post by aembleton »

gmac wrote: post #207
callamdelaney wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 24 and voted for brexit. In fact I campaigned for it and would do so again. It's really a very poor form to resort to the "dumb old racists voted for brexit hurr".

OK, so the problem is that I find it basically impossible to understand how a well-informed and rational person could come to the conclusions you've come to. The EU isn't perfect, but you'll struggle to argue that it hasn't expanded peace, prosperity and human rights across the continent. This is motherhood-and-apple-pie stuff. Arguments in favour of Brexit thus tend to boil down to immigration and 'sovereignty'. The…

> that the ones in charge of 'taking back control' are also the ones stifling parliament, suppressing voting, and attacking academics, judges and the rule of law.

Do you really want them to have an influence across the whole of the EU? By leaving, our dysfunctional politicians lose influence which will help with the peace and human rights that you mentioned earlier.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#252

Post by Kim_Bruning »

klingon78 wrote: post #205
vmception wrote: post #9

I honestly get giggles from how unprepared they are culturally for what becoming America-like will do to them. Does anyone else? American-like but with no negotiating leverage and having burned all the bridges to the other economic unions.

The US has a similar privacy law in California they must support, and many companies have presence globally, so they are having to deal with this in the following ways, like many others. GDPR has given a 50M EUR handslap to Google and similar to some other large companies[1] while seriously hurting smaller companies with existing custom web applications for whom they may not even have someone on staff to modify those…

It's actually fairly easy to be GDPR compliant almost by default, TBQH. It either takes a lot of effort or a lot of laziness to somehow end up non-compliant.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#253

Post by rich_sasha »

martin_a wrote: post #13
rich_sasha wrote: post #4

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, I think GDPR is a great step towards stopping companies hoarding your data and holding you hostage to it. On the other, main GDPR change is those awful 'hand over data / pretend you're not' dialogue boxes. When I'm feeling strong, I look for the 'reject / object / blah' box, but often I don't find it in me to resist anymore. So maybe it's not awful they're reshaping…

The GDPR sets a pretty straight border for this. No active (this does NOT include "by using this site you accept...") approval = no permission to collect data and give it to third parties. That's the law. But we'll still need some hard work and hefty fines to make everyone obey it.

Right - the law sounds good. But it's not the practice I see on the t'Internet.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#254

Post by gmac »

aembleton wrote: post #251
gmac wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, so the problem is that I find it basically impossible to understand how a well-informed and rational person could come to the conclusions you've come to. The EU isn't perfect, but you'll struggle to argue that it hasn't expanded peace, prosperity and human rights across the continent. This is motherhood-and-apple-pie stuff. Arguments in favour of Brexit thus tend to boil down to immigration and 'sovereignty'. The…

> that the ones in charge of 'taking back control' are also the ones stifling parliament, suppressing voting, and attacking academics, judges and the rule of law. Do you really want them to have an influence across the whole of the EU? By leaving, our dysfunctional politicians lose influence which will help with the peace and human rights that you mentioned earlier.

I'm in the UK, so you got me: it seems I take a somewhat self-interested view on human rights! More seriously, though, the UK used to be a major world advocate for human rights, so UK human rights going down the pan probably isn't great for human rights worldwide.

Peace takes two sides, so it's hard to argue that having your dysfunctional politicians run unchecked isn't going to lead to worse outcomes across the board.

Edit: maybe you were joking? Ha ha.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#255

Post by viraptor »

auganov wrote: post #204
viraptor wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think so? What do you think EU has to gain from UK doing badly? And I mean in practice, economically - we're way past the time "told you so" is relevant.

If the EU cannot show there's a big exit cost it may not last too much longer. Economic growth is so lackluster all across the EU, including new entrants, that few people (who looked at the data) genuinely believe EU membership is a GDP booster. EU's next best bet is to play into the fear that exiting will bring about economic ruin. This works particularly well on newer members who may not be on good terms with core…

We already saw the big exit cost. Tariffs will apply where trade deals are missing. I'm not sure who you expect to use sanctions - EU won't slap anyone with sanctions just because they left EU. Have a look at https://sanctionsmap.eu/ for situations where sanctions have been applied.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#256

Post by callamdelaney »

dash2 wrote: post #236
monkey_monkey wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the referendum was stacked against Remain, as Leave covered every single possible variation of not being in the EU, and at no point had to define anything except being "Not Remain"

I don't think that's a stacked decision. There's no way to specify exactly what each of two options will entail. (If you don't believe me, take a look at a California ballot pamphlet.) Of course Leave was gonna be more uncertain - but normally such uncertainty plays against you in referendums, where the status quo tends to win. If Remain didn't pin Leave down, then that's the fault of their campaigning, not the setup…

Playing on this uncertainty was a conscious decision by the pro remain Conservative government of the time. People would ask 'what will happen after we vote brexit?' the natural reply: 'nobody knows' - well why not?

It was clearly reckless to hold a vote on something without a plan on how it was actually to be implemented or even what it might look like; and there were calls for the government to do some investigation here and publish a report or some such document - the decision not to do so was in order to sow that uncertainty.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#257

Post by Nursie »

gmac wrote: post #207
callamdelaney wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 24 and voted for brexit. In fact I campaigned for it and would do so again. It's really a very poor form to resort to the "dumb old racists voted for brexit hurr".

OK, so the problem is that I find it basically impossible to understand how a well-informed and rational person could come to the conclusions you've come to. The EU isn't perfect, but you'll struggle to argue that it hasn't expanded peace, prosperity and human rights across the continent. This is motherhood-and-apple-pie stuff. Arguments in favour of Brexit thus tend to boil down to immigration and 'sovereignty'. The…

> The EU isn't perfect, but you'll struggle to argue that it hasn't expanded peace, prosperity and human rights across the continent.

Is it necessary for the UK to stay in for this peace to continue? Would you like to talk to some of the southern states about the expansion of prosperity that has come along with monetary union?

> There's a consensus amongst economists that immigration makes us financially better off.

In aggregate, not individually. Great for those of us in the middle classes, but I have a lot of sympathy for those who see their low wages effectively pegged to minimum wage, and who have to compete for those minimum wage jobs with a huge pool of people.

We have stories of fruit and veg going unpicked because labour can't be imported as easily, and the few brits who enquired about the work wouldn't do it, they wouldn't live on the farm and work long days for the lowest possible pay. This speaks to me of industries in dire need of reform, propped up by the importation of those willing to accept standards nobody should have to accept, because of a disparity in wealth between countries.

Was leaving the EU the right way to go about fixing this? Probably not, but to sweep these issues under the rug or worse, call people racist because of them, was counterproductive.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#258

Post by dash2 »

gmac wrote: post #207
callamdelaney wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 24 and voted for brexit. In fact I campaigned for it and would do so again. It's really a very poor form to resort to the "dumb old racists voted for brexit hurr".

OK, so the problem is that I find it basically impossible to understand how a well-informed and rational person could come to the conclusions you've come to. The EU isn't perfect, but you'll struggle to argue that it hasn't expanded peace, prosperity and human rights across the continent. This is motherhood-and-apple-pie stuff. Arguments in favour of Brexit thus tend to boil down to immigration and 'sovereignty'. The…

> OK, so the problem is that I find it basically impossible to understand how a well-informed and rational person could come to the conclusions you've come to.

That is indeed a problem, but it is your problem. If 48% of people support anything, there must be some reasons for it.

You're right about the consensus among economists. At the same time, 10 years ago there was a consensus about the virtues of free trade. Then Autor et al. wrote "The China Shock" and other similar papers, and, well, now there's not a consensus any more. Also, economics isn't immune to bias. Are papers showing a link from immigration to low wages, or crime, or reduced trust, likely to get a fair hearing?

Is desire for ethnic homogeneity close to racism? It seems to be very widely shared - including among impeccable liberals. See the evidence on white flight in Kaufmann's Whiteshift. Homophily is close to a human universal, so it's not obvious that it is wrong, or stupid, to prefer others like ourselves.

If we trade we have to accept rules. But now we get to choose which, right? As you say, if we don't like US rules on chicken, we can trade that off against the costs. The value of tying ourselves to the EU depends on how you view its future. There's a fair case that it is an aging, sclerotic continent that can only make money by imposing fines on US tech companies. I don't say that's the only perspective that you can make.

Lastly, the UK is a democracy. The EU, hardly (see Perry Anderson's recent essays in the LRB for a fairly comprehensive account). Democracy sure has its flaws, but doesn't the threat of the boot encourage politicians to get things done? In this context, the contrast between the UK's vaccination program and the EU's is telling.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#259

Post by Nursie »

hnlmorg wrote: post #73
jleask wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

48% of us realized this

This is the thing that pissed me off the most about the referendum. The result was touted as an overwhelming majority but in fact the percentages are well within the margin for error on a poll that wasn't very well defined from the outset (ie what "leave" meant was different for different people). The only thing the EU referendum conclusively demonstrated was how easily manipulated people are by the media they consum…

> within the margin for error

What do people mean when they say this?

The referendum wasn't a statistical exercise that sampled a subset, so the idea of "error" seems really oddly applied here.

Re: UK to depart from GDPR

#260

Post by thinkingemote »

soren_dahl wrote: post #171

Link says Government sent a "first signal of its intention", title says "UK to depart". Comments skip straight to how dumb we all are. :shrug:

It's like this for most stories and subjects to be honest. It's just that technology news has more people knowing what's actually going on.
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