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Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

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Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#441

Post by sjm »

Jonanin wrote: post #411
sjm wrote: post #30

If personalized ads are really so beneficial to their customers, Facebook should have no problem convincing them to allow the tracking they need and opt-in.

Apple controls the messaging on the dialog, not FB. It is worded in such a way that >95% of people will likely disallow it.

Part of the messaging (the title and buttons) is built-in, but in all of these sorts of dialogs apps provide their own strings to explain why they're asking for permission. The screenshot in the original article shows where Facebook can explain to end-users why they need to track them across other apps and websites.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#443

Post by notyourday »

edmundsauto wrote: post #386
notyourday wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At scale? Margin of error at best. I will tell you what my interests are by vising web properties that cater to them in that specific time. You deciding to keep showing me ads for a Nespresso machine when I'm reading about circular saws is idiotic.

That doesn’t pass the sniff test. Would you say that in general, you wouldn’t expect a difference in results if you sold Taylor swift albums to white suburban women in Iowa, versus black urban men in Atlanta?

You know what would blow both of those out of the water? Selling it to those that have indicated that they are interested in Taylor Swift as white suburban women in Iowa do not buy Taylor Swift albums. They buy mom jeans. Instead they are getting ads for Taylor Swift.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#444

Post by stingraycharles »

rchaud wrote: post #392
buzzerbetrayed wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some reason I have a bad feeling about this update actually getting released. I'm worried that FB is going to convince some judge to tell Apple they can't do this, and delay it for months or years. Maybe (hopefully) this is an irrational worry, but you never know the extent to which people will go when billions of dollars are on the line.

I think what's more likely than any kind of legal injunction is that FB and Apple will come to a "mutual understanding". Maybe Facebook will license Apple Maps (for a princely sum) and make some symbolic compromise on data collection that lets Apple water down the permission dialogs.

I’d argue that Apple executives realize that privacy is one of the unique USPs of Apple compared to their main competitor, since the value exchange between Apple and their customers is simpler (customer pays Apple money, Apple delivers hardware/software).

Now that so much news has spread about these privacy additions, Apple selling out will actively hurt this image they have spent a lot of time building. It’s going to have to be an extremely lucrative agreement between them and Facebook for it to be worth it.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#445

Post by jwalton »

svachalek wrote: post #380
czbond wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wholly internalized that there was a real problem when I started taking my phone to other parts of the house, placing it in a drawer before returning and shutting the door to have an in person conversation with someone.

I've started using the mobile sites for companies like Facebook that I kind of need to use occasionally but really don't want their horrifying app on my phone. It's kind of fascinating how hard they (not just Facebook) push you to use their "so much better" app even when their HTML version seems just as good if not better. It's just so much better for them . If you try the app and it's not better then you know what i…

My daughter uses Messenger Kids to interact with her friends, now that COVID means she can’t see any of them in real life. (It wouldn’t have been my first choice, but it’s what all the other kids are on, so we have no real choice.)

If she adds a friend, it’ll send me a messenger message telling me I have to approve it, with a link. If I try to follow that link, it will tell me that my desktop browser can’t be used to manage Messenger Kids and that I have to install the app on my phone. Although it seems like in most cases you can open up Messenger Kids in the panel on the left, and then there will be an approve/deny button, so it’s mostly lies that you can’t do this on desktop.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#446

Post by judge2020 »

zepto wrote: post #431
judge2020 wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and don't hesitate even to shut down billion dollar apps (i.e., Fortnite). It's fairly obvious that, given Epic was saying "you can pay $2 less to get the same amount of vbucks" that Apple was going to lose a huge portion of revenue from the App if they didn't pull it, and if they actually left it up, they'd have to allow every other app to institute third-party payment processors as well to not appear like they're…

Given that vbucks are just made up and have no marginal cost, Epic can say whatever they like about how much less they can charge for them. It doesn’t mean anything at all.

I'm saying that Apple was going to get shafted on payments and making money from Epic anyways if they left it up because Epic was charging $2 less when paying directly via a card and bypassing in-app purchases.

https://www.epicgames.com/fortnite/en-US/news/the-fortnite-m...

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#447

Post by johannes1234321 »

judge2020 wrote: post #319
titzer wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember back in 2002 when I took a college course on Computer Security and the prof told story after harrowing story of the lengths to which spy agencies went to get the information they were after. I remember thinking, "Well if the NSA really wanted to track everyone and record everything that was ever transmitted over the internet, I suppose they could. But nah, that's crazy." Fast forward to 2013 and Snowden. O…

The poster you're replying to did not say that AMZN/GOOG/AAPL wouldn't spy on you, they simply stated that evidence should be considered to justify claims, especially if you're trying to spread those claims to other people. Your argument "we should sound alarms without evidence because tomorrow we'll have evidence" is classic conspiracy theory reasoning, which is why people will classify you as one. In essence, we sh…

The issue is: We can't prove it either way. We can make law which increases the risk if they are uncovered and hope they abide to it (see GDPR and California Law for attempts in that direction) but a prove is hard.

At the same time we see the incentives, and the incentives are to collect and analyze things.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#448

Post by dylan604 »

parsimo2010 wrote: post #165
Spooky23 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really weird. I don't think the "threat" is the obvious one... Nobody trusts Facebook -- many, if not most, people honestly believe they listen to their conversations already. The real message is how emotional and immature the leadership is to a perceived slight. A message that said "Cigarettes will kill you" didn't stop smokers, and some label won't stop Facebook users or meaningfully impact Facebook. Hell, whe…

It won’t cause Facebook to go bankrupt (less well-targeted ads can still be sold but aren’t worth as much), but it will meaningfully impact them. Most high level Facebook employees have significant amounts of Facebook stock. Even the implication that Facebook’s ad revenue will decrease is going to lower their stock price. So of course they are going to try to prevent this change- if it becomes permanent they are taki…

> if it becomes permanent they are taking a hit to their retirement savings.

poor little snow flakes. i have zero sympathy

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#449

Post by move-on-by »

dhdhhdd wrote: post #226

How can an app track activities in other apps? Is it only possible if those other apps use the same tracking networks, or can the app track activities in _any_ other app? How does this work? What can facebook extract today? (I'm surprised a bit, i thought phones offer app isolation). The only things that comes to mind is to correlate device ids from different apps if the apps use the same analytics/advertising networ…

My understanding is that, by default, Apple devices have an IDFA (Identifier for Advertisers) that apps can use to correlate usage to a specific device. That identifier is going to be the same regardless of app, so it can easily be shared between data aggregators. You've been able to turn this off for ages deep in your apple settings - but of course most people don't bother with that (70% is the number I found). This update brings that feature front-and-center by making it a popup. I suppose that it also makes it app-specific instead of the previous system wide setting? Not sure on that one. At least that is my understanding, if someone knows better please inform me.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#450

Post by dylan604 »

worker767424 wrote: post #376
edoceo wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Escape hatches? Edit: Ok. Maybe https://news.yahoo.com/mark-zuckerberg-reportedly-escape-hat...

Calling it now: for all the hate Zuckerberg gets now, he's going to be Bill Gates in 25 years, and they only people who won't trust him are the vaccine mind control nuts.

I don't see this happening, unless The Zuck has some sort of Scrooge moment. He just doesn't seem the type.
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