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The unusual ways Western parents raise children

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441–450 of 684 posts

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#441
post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hm I improvised an adjective for orthodoxy. Maybe it's orthodoxic .. I hope you get the meaning now.

The adjective form of orthodoxy is orthodox. Think of something like the "Orthodox" church. And it's antonym is "unorthodox", for example: "the unorthodox church" ;)

And what's the term for adding redundant adjective suffix to an adjective ? :)

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of areas open to the public that are accessible to children: playgrounds, libraries, schoolyards, skateparks, large underused parking lots, malls, public pools. Some places have great nature nearby: beaches, creeks, rivers, hills, and mountains. Some of those are more dangerous than others, but they are all accessible if the parent allows it.

In the US, if the children in question are under 12 and going to any of those places unsupervised, they're likely to get the police and/or CPS called on them.

This upsets me a lot. I'm in my 30's and I was still allowed to ride bikes around the neighborhood, go to the store for snacks, etc. with my brother. I don't understand how kids can develop a sense of exploration without these opportunities. Hopefully it's still possible to develop it during the teen years.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#443

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Odds are good the couple you mention are in fact negative net worth, or close to it. They don't own the car. Every time their house goes up in value they refinance and take the cash out to pay for the vacation. Generally those with a significant net worth live more modest lives - older cars (they might buy new, but that is because they know if they do the maintenance it will last for 15-20 years). The house might be…

In the US, a doctor/lawyer dual income couple should be earning at least $300k, if not $500k+ per year. Source: https://www.medscape.com/slideshow/2020-compensation-overvie... Even with $600k to $800k ($4k to $6k per month loan payments) of student loans, they should be able to pull off a decent lifestyle and be positive net worth by their mid 40s.

I thought a large number of lawyers end up not earning much?

And straight out of university, you really can’t look at the average, because the income distribution of lawyers is extremely bimodal in the US: https://www.biglawinvestor.com/bimodal-salary-distribution-c...

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#444
post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like anything else in life, you can do a good job or a bad job at being a parent. If you're prioritizing your own convenience or ego or career over the wellbeing of your child, then you're a bad parent. Sounds like you have no clue. Try looking after 3 babies then come back an talk to us.

Sounds like you're making excuses instead of stepping up and taking responsibility for the choices you made.

This is a pretty terrible accusation for someone who you know nothing about. Why would you take the argument here?

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#445
post #324

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Have you ever met 1 years old? Cause this sounds like you did not and are just imagining things.

I have, yes - four of them, up close and in detail.

One year old are just learning to walk. They are slow and dumb. If they play on street, it is 100% fault of adult. If adult is beating them after that, adult should not have a kid.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, a doctor/lawyer dual income couple should be earning at least $300k, if not $500k+ per year. Source: https://www.medscape.com/slideshow/2020-compensation-overvie... Even with $600k to $800k ($4k to $6k per month loan payments) of student loans, they should be able to pull off a decent lifestyle and be positive net worth by their mid 40s.

I thought a large number of lawyers end up not earning much? And straight out of university, you really can’t look at the average, because the income distribution of lawyers is extremely bimodal in the US: https://www.biglawinvestor.com/bimodal-salary-distribution-c...

But not for doctors. The lower end of the household income range I listed is achievable by doctors alone. I would also presume doctors are more often than not marrying lawyers on the higher end of the income scale.

Bottom line, based on numerous personal experiences and pay data, I do not expect lawyer/doctor families to have the quality of life the person I was responding to claim they have, on average.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#447
post #340

One thing that I find weird about the Western (perhaps just American) way of raising kids is that the retired population is surprisingly uninvolved in the raising of their grandchildren. It seems like an economic inefficiency when parents are spending so much money on childcare while old people are feeling increasingly lonely.

I am from the U.S. My mother has my kids at least two days a week. It saves me money, gives her an excuse to come over, and the kids love it. After I finish working we will typically make dinner together. I did not have this sort of experience growing up and I'm really glad things have worked out this way for my kids.

If only I could get her to stop cleaning everything while she's at my house and filling my fridge with vegan alternatives.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#448
post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

There's the extinction method which is the most hardcore and there's also the Ferber method which has the parent periodically check in with the baby.

Extinction is extreme, as one is basically abandoning the child to cry. They're scared, they don't know what's happening and they're alone.

Sure, they're (probably?) not gonna suffer long-term damage, but it's just an asshole thing to do. In the book recommending this method all parents had their instincts screaming that they're doing something wrong and they were feeling guilty even if it worked.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On the contrary, Kanner held tightly to his original proposal that autism was an innate condition, which was widely understood to mean it had a genetic basis. His behavioral observations of parents contributed to a breakthrough concept that is wholly consistent with genes being a key part of the autism story. Instead of parenting causing autism, Kanner’s idea — which has since been validated — was that autism (and…

Fascinating how classic research from the 40s has been turned on its head completely. Would be interesting to see parent's response.

I can think of some rather obvious reasons why Kanner would reframe his position publicly. It's just way too taboo.

Kanner said that his believed autism had a genetic basis. I think it's a cop-out, as I don't think it makes any sense to blame genetics for the sudden appearance and dramatic rise of autism (and other childhood disorders) over the timespan of a few decades, even if genetics may certainly play a role in our susceptibility to these disorders.

In any case, this is merely my suspicion. I'm not a researcher on this subject.

The reason why I wrote that comment is because the stakes are high and the evidence is suggestive enough that this merits more of a discussion.

Every parent has to decide how much attention their child gets. How many parents would do things differently if they knew the impact it could have? Reading the research definitely opened my eyes and changed my opinion on how to raise our child.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the hunter-gatherer parenting practices that get pushed on certain parenting blogs are pseudo-scientific and shouldn't be adopted. And some of claims that a baby crying is dumping enough cortisol into their bodies it will permanently damage their brains is NOT supported by science. What does have a strong scientific basis: the importance of sleep hygiene. Children don't need perfection or goofy hunter-gathere…

"And some of claims that a baby crying is dumping enough cortisol into their bodies it will permanently damage their brains is NOT supported by science." This is misleading. You're correct that there is not conclusive scientific evidence either way, but there are decent studies that support the cortisol theory. Not necessarily that it will "damage their brains", but that cortisol levels spike during sleep training an…

I get the impression you're equating sleep training with the old fashioned "cry it out" method. We loosely followed the Karp method and had very little crying and a very happy baby.
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