Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors • Hacker News Board

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#251

Post by avsteele » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:22 PM UTC

This is the most important part of the essay:

   Uncertainty remains, research sometimes conflicts and biological pathways aren’t always clear. There are competing theories about whether the sperm count decline is real and what might cause it and about why girls appear to be reaching puberty earlier, and it’s sometimes unclear whether an increase in male genital abnormalities reflects actual rising numbers or just better reporting.

You should maintain a very low prior probability of this being true without more information. Remember correlation usually != causation

https://www.gwern.net/Causality

There are a lot of other possible causes for all the these declines. (obesity and lower physical activity being only the most likely-seeming to me)

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#252

Post by ejolto » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:26 PM UTC

ceejayoz wrote: post #219

ejolto wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is that enough? It must have been enough since his sperm count increased 4x, no? Either the filter worked or microplastics don't effect sperm count much.

I’ve got an anti-tiger rock to sell you… “Something changed, therefore this must be the reason” is a fallacy if there isn’t additional supporting evidence.

We are talking about an anecdote here, not giving general advice based on scientific literature.

That said. If I lived in a village that was attacked by tigers regularly for 6 months, and I installed a tiger filter which stopped the attacks, I would gladly pay 30 bucks for that ($30 is what a faucet water filter costs).

Disclaimer: I don't own a water filter or a tiger filter.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#253

Post by galangalalgol » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:27 PM UTC

avsteele wrote: post #251

This is the most important part of the essay: Uncertainty remains, research sometimes conflicts and biological pathways aren’t always clear. There are competing theories about whether the sperm count decline is real and what might cause it and about why girls appear to be reaching puberty earlier, and it’s sometimes unclear whether an increase in male genital abnormalities reflects actual rising numbers or just bette…

Obesity being a correlation might mean it is also a symptom. We already know from a couple studies that people with the same activity level and calorie intake are significantly more overweight than in the 80s. One leading hypothesis is endocrine disruptors.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#254

Post by User23 » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:29 PM UTC

lupire wrote: post #217

tracker1 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a lot of it comes down to how it's processed... fermentation probably made it safer to consume over time. I think the aversion to dietary fat for the past 3 generations combined with refined seed/bean oils has been hugely detrimental to human health as well. Not to mention, even with reductions, we still consume a massive amount of sugar per capita compared to pre-wwii levels.

Oils are dietary fats though?

Refined seed oils are synthetic chemicals that just happen to use seeds as a feedstock in a relatively novel chemical reaction.

Yes one can quibble that cooking is a chemical reaction, but it’s one that is both simple and that we’re long since evolved to tolerate.

I stick to mechanically produced vegetable oils and animal fats. It’s not only healthier but it tastes better too.

However, a healthy diet depends a great deal on your race. A traditional Inuit diet is observably healthy for Inuit persons, but probably best avoided by people like me. However there are no humans that are evolved to eat seed oils.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#255

Post by mizzack » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:30 PM UTC

eyko wrote: post #174

DoreenMichele wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost 95 percent of the soybeans grown in the U.S. are genetically modified. https://www.thedailymeal.com/travel/8-most-genetically-modif... In 2007, over half the world’s soybean crop was genetically modified; a higher percentage than any other crop. https://worldofgenetics.weebly.com/genetically-modified-soyb... Asians are probably eating less GMO soy (than Americans) and we don't really know what those genetic mo…

> They are typically made to improve profit in some fashion, not to improve human health. The main goals of GMOs are to increase yield and protect against disease / pests, which is practically the same goal we've had for thousands of years of crop domestication. Take for instance wild pre-domesticated maize vs present day non-GMO maize[1] and you'll see what "natural" crop selection does. Not only do we select for st…

Your pesticide/herbicide primary concern is a defining feature of GMO staples: glyphosate tolerance.

I.e. you're going to find a lot more Roundup in GMO end products than non-GMO.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#256

Post by siltpotato » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:31 PM UTC

XiJInPaddington wrote: post #18

vincentmarle wrote: post #2

> Store food in glass containers, not plastic. Above all, don’t microwave foods in plastic or with plastic wrap on top. Avoid pesticides. Buy organic produce if possible. Avoid tobacco or marijuana. Use a cotton or linen shower curtain, not one made of vinyl. Don’t use air fresheners. Prevent dust buildup. Vet consumer products you use with an online guide like that of the Environmental Working Group. I really want t…

Because its the same thing as a person setting your house on fire then advising you not to breathe in the smoke. Advice like telling people we are drowning in plastic because we don't recycle, telling people with no access to public transportation to minimize the use of cars, telling people with no access to healthcare to take care of their bodies, telling people that grew up in a glorified prison they call public sc…

Is the parent article by a plastic producer? I'm tired of this priest comparison at every corner.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#257

Post by xorfish » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:34 PM UTC

hef19898 wrote: post #143

yudlejoza wrote: post #65

Pick a random essential nutrient. For instance, take zinc. Human body needs it. It needs to be taken in. You need to ensure the right food items, or the right supplements, doesn't matter. Where does that source come from? plants? animals? imported? produced? What goes into that? What's the prevalent intake level in developed countries? developing countries? what should be the right intake level? where (which parts of…

Or just stop, or reduce as much as possible, the amount of crap we eat? There is no reason why meat has to be that low cost. Or that we cannot cook ourselves with fresh ingredients, ideally grown and sourced locally. Nutrition, being a basic of human survival, has been sovled for millenias. We just lost it with pushing industrialized food production, of any kid, way to far over the point needed to get rid of starvati…

> Or just stop, or reduce as much as possible, the amount of crap we eat?

Finding out what crap is, is really really hard if you want to be scientific. It may be possible for some bigger categories.

Reducing is also really, really hard.

Nutrition hasn't been solved for millenia, humans just ate what they could eat, if they had enough.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#258

Post by ntsplnkv2 » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:35 PM UTC

galangalalgol wrote: post #253

avsteele wrote: post #251

This is the most important part of the essay: Uncertainty remains, research sometimes conflicts and biological pathways aren’t always clear. There are competing theories about whether the sperm count decline is real and what might cause it and about why girls appear to be reaching puberty earlier, and it’s sometimes unclear whether an increase in male genital abnormalities reflects actual rising numbers or just bette…

Obesity being a correlation might mean it is also a symptom. We already know from a couple studies that people with the same activity level and calorie intake are significantly more overweight than in the 80s. One leading hypothesis is endocrine disruptors.

I'd be very wary of any studies that ask people to identify "activity level."

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#259

Post by Bakary » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:37 PM UTC

Manifretto wrote: post #206

andy_ppp wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really love his shtick generally (a bit too try hard and salesman for my liking) but I think he's honest and not trying to con anyone. For example I tried the slow carb diet he proposes and I lost tonnes of weight.

He is probably coning on a subtile not relevant level. I googled his SCD and yes its the same schema f with his book and everything else he does. It is not new at all. His website uses the same technics to promote 'his' revolutionary things while never ever having done anthing new anything relevant at all. And i read his 4-hour workweek. I payed for that book. His charisma triggerd me to get it. This still doesn't me…

>I personally would not be proud of myself though if i had his 'career'.

It's interesting how we are primed to assume a psychological burden for anyone who is financially successful. Perhaps to help ourselves cope? I'm not singling your comment out specifically, as I often have the same reaction.

For all we know, Ferriss is probably highly satisfied, completely at ease with himself, and enjoying a great and varied existence.

Re: Falling sperm counts, declining egg quality, and endocrine disruptors

#260

Post by Bakary » Tue, Feb 23, 2021, 1:38 PM UTC

andy_ppp wrote: post #187

Manifretto wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tim Ferris is half conartist half motivation speaker.

I don't really love his shtick generally (a bit too try hard and salesman for my liking) but I think he's honest and not trying to con anyone. For example I tried the slow carb diet he proposes and I lost tonnes of weight.

I can't comment on Ferriss specifically, but almost any marketable diet can work in the short term since it makes you pay attention to what you eat. That fact alone is enough for results.