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CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

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Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#571

Post by atlgator »

eigenvector wrote: post #277
nataz wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This guy gets it. Development is literally the simplest part of the problem set. The intersection of domain expertise, contracting/procurement creativity, and technical evaluation is the tough part to wrangle. Getting to the point where development can start is 95% of the battle in my experience. Not to trivialize the actual development portion of the project, but most missteps happen early, dooming projects before a…

Now think of the problem in reverse, from the government's side. Why are they contracting it out when all of the most difficult aspects involve integrating with government systems, policies and personnel - things that government already knows how to do? "Because we don't have the expertise to do software development." The comments in this thread, which I fully agree with by the way, just cement my belief that if gove…

The problem is you can't fire Government employees. The impact of hiring specialized staff that don't perform is very high.

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#572

Post by wp381640 »

snarf21 wrote: post #521
zaroth wrote: post #115

> Deloitte is the only contractor that can meet the project requirements, because configuration of the VAMS application is occurring using Deloitte’s propriety GovConnect platform. Therefore, no other contractor has rights or access to leverage the system to carry out O&M activities, such as the administration of the system, change and defect management and end user support. As the only contractor with the GovConnect…

This is a major problem with using contractors. They bill by the hour. Their continued employment is not dependent on doing a good job. They half ass everything because it is about billing and being done. Also, doing a bad job means "overruns" for more free money. The government needs a Department of Technology that runs all these systems for all national systems that are needed. This isn't like building a combat fig…

The problem is because of government pay scales they can’t fill those digital agency roles with the right people

Within a year or two the good staff end up working at the consulting shops and influence their former employers

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#573

Post by williamdclt »

blackpowder12 wrote: post #516
eigenvector wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now think of the problem in reverse, from the government's side. Why are they contracting it out when all of the most difficult aspects involve integrating with government systems, policies and personnel - things that government already knows how to do? "Because we don't have the expertise to do software development." The comments in this thread, which I fully agree with by the way, just cement my belief that if gove…

the UK has done exactly this - to make all Government Digital Services in house. It's been a blockbuster success in my opinion - they have some of the best UX/UI in the world and their websites are ultralight and downgrade well. There are a few issues with authentication, but there is support. Everything that's related to dealing with the UK government btw is all in ONE website, where everything is explained to you i…

As a foreigner living in the UK, I concur. All .gov.uk are _extremely_ functional. Applying for the pre-settled status (cos Brexit) was actually an enjoyable experience! I had no idea what was going to happen when I started the process, and it was all done in 30min top. It made me _scan my passport with my smartphone_ while flashing weird colors and it worked flowlessly, that absolutely blew my mind.

I've actually looked into getting a job there even though I'm from a start-up background

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#575

Post by ineedasername »

aasasd wrote: post #400
zaroth wrote: post #115

> Deloitte is the only contractor that can meet the project requirements, because configuration of the VAMS application is occurring using Deloitte’s propriety GovConnect platform. Therefore, no other contractor has rights or access to leverage the system to carry out O&M activities, such as the administration of the system, change and defect management and end user support. As the only contractor with the GovConnect…

Reads like a copy of Russian government contract practices. Put up a contest, list requirements in such a way that only one company would satisfy them without going bust or mad, award the contract to that company. ‘Make the thing using this and that technologies’ does appear regularly.

It's not that it reads like a Russian government contract, it reads a bit like any government contract.

The problem here isn't even necessarily with the government: Had they gone with anyone else at a sane price tag, Deloitte would have sued that company to oblivion and the Government as well, probably for all sorts of IP issues.

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#576

Post by gnu8 »

1cvmask wrote: post #569
sokoloff wrote: post #560

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on what you see as the purpose of the visa requirements. If the purpose is to support economic prospects for American citizens and current residents (which seems like a completely valid purpose of government), then putting hurdles to ensure the job opening was “shopped” to qualified existing authorized workers seems pretty reasonable. (I should clarify that I’m fully in favor of immigration programs that…

Increased supply of labor depresses wages ceteris paribus. That is why George W Bush and older generation Republicans always supported legal AND illegal immigration. Their constituents were the businesss that thrived and made more profits from a cheaper laborforce. The Democrats were historically hostile to immigration because their base was the working class. Now that Wall Street and Big Business has gone Democratic…

> ceteris paribus

Today I learned another useful latin expression.

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#577

Post by jacquesm »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #498
jon-wood wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the responsibilities of the UK’s Government Digital Service is to review any IT spending by other departments, and are staffed so that in many cases they can implement and support products themselves rather than outsourcing them. My understanding is that other departments are making headway in being allowed to bypass that process, but at their peak GDS were fantastic at shutting down bad projects before they’d…

tl;dr it's not working Well how the hell do we have a £40M contract for supply of laptops to schoolkids filled by a noname laptop supplier using the jankiest (really low quality, really poor spec) laptops worth maybe £100 but being charged to the taxpayer at >£300 each. School IT people are getting them delivered, a lot are broken, and the cost of repair is given as more than the cost of buying _retail_ a better repl…

This is especially sad given that the BBC micro project in the 80's was a resounding success and showed exactly how these project should be run.

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#578

Post by sul_tasto »

ThinkBeat wrote: post #511
aasasd wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reads like a copy of Russian government contract practices. Put up a contest, list requirements in such a way that only one company would satisfy them without going bust or mad, award the contract to that company. ‘Make the thing using this and that technologies’ does appear regularly.

This is quite common in the US. For a while my entire job ended up writing proposals and all the related nonsense for federal an state government contracts. I did not like that one bit. However spending week after week trying to divine the meaning behind phrases and terms. It shortly became apparent that some parts of the government would consistently have requirements only applicable to one vendor. That saved a lot…

What I don’t understand is why auditors can’t or won’t put a stop to this.

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#579

Post by bitexploder »

jspaetzel wrote: post #342
bitexploder wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then supporting it. For a decade. 44m might be bloated, but, it goes quick and it is work no one really wants to do due to how hairy and legacy it can get.

Ongoing support isn't the issue here, this is basically a greenfield project with nothing hairy to get in the way.

These contracts often have the hosting and other support fees over some long period built in. I didn’t dig into this one specifically, but it’s quite common.

Re: CDC website built by Deloitte at a cost of $44M is abandoned due to bugs

#580

Post by ianhawes »

tootie wrote: post #187
jnathsf wrote: post #169

Deloitte is using salesforce for the underlying technology of the system. So almost all of this work is configuration and maybe some customization. We worked with another state that almost selected Deloitte but they bombed the no cost bake off and ultimately chose another vendor which completed 80% of the work during the bake off. This approach lowers risk dramatically and you’re able to set an aggressive and a more…

They probably got sold on it being "off the shelf" and just a matter of customization and not coding. But the minute they run into edge cases (of which there are likely hundreds given the nature of the product) they just end up stuck.

"COTS software" (commercial off-the-shelf) is the biggest meme in government contracting.

I recall reading a 300+ page PDF RFP for a DMV information management system. The state wanted to convert their legacy VB5(!) system to a modern solution and preferred a COTS solution. I am fairly certain there are no COTS software solutions for a statewide DMV that also meets the legislative requirements of the state.

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