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Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

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Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#511

Post by troydavis »

ghaff wrote: post #504
troydavis wrote: post #484

I'm a little disappointed at the percentage of comments which extrapolate personal anecdotes into societal behavior, and without addressing the data in this study - even to poke holes in the methodology, which is totally fair game (though IMO quite good, especially for what they had to work with). The whole point of a 15,000-person survey like this is so that we're not all stuck guessing based on our own experiences.…

One thing I wish more studies delved into more--although, as you say, what people think today and what they'll actually do may be different--is the difference between part-time (even most-time) WFH and fully remote because that's actually a pretty big distinction. It might be the difference between having a very long commute one day a week and living in a mountain town or on the other side of the country.

Yes, that is a big distinction. Page 39 of this survey may shed some light on that question. Of those who WFH'ed at some point during COVID (essentially anyone who can WFH at all), they asked "In 2022+ (after COVID) how often would you like to have paid work days at home?". The answer set doesn't separate local-only from living anywhere, but it does list 5 days/week as its own answer.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#512

Post by ashtonkem »

ntsplnkv2 wrote: post #174
ashtonkem wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average Millenial worker will job hop every 1-3 years. While it’s good to be friendly with your colleagues, you also shouldn’t build friend networks that get broken and reformed with such regularity.

This makes no sense. Just because you switch jobs doesn't mean you can never talk to people at your old job never again.

Of course it doesn’t mean that you can’t talk to those people ever again, but unless if you put in a lot of ground work to create a common connection external to work, most of those friendships will evaporate the moment they lose the shared experience of working at the same place.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#513

Post by nkohari »

wisty wrote: post #118
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #29

I've been 100% remote and run remote teams since 2014 and I promise that it won't stick for the broader society. Here's why: 1. Socializing is the primary activity that happens at work for the vast majority of workers. The gal or guy coming by your desk to "check in" or "see how your weekend was" etc... is literally where they find their social outlets and personal connections. 2. Managers like to be able to watch th…

I think it's worth looking into "theory of the firm" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_the_firm Why should employees even exist? Shouldn't firms just sack everyone, then hire contractors? I often hear advocates of remote work talk about "presenteeism" and how managers need to just focus more on outputs. This is fine, but if they can do that why not sack everyone and just hire contractors and pay for the outpu…

Providing employees with a sense of ownership and belonging is a surprisingly strong motivator. People who feel they have a skin in the game will naturally work harder.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#514

Post by ashtonkem »

dannyw wrote: post #171
ashtonkem wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the things you’re describing are actually the consequences of things being really broken. Some of that is obvious (e.g. point 2), but the rest is subtle. My biggest concern is #1. While everyone has always socialized at work, it seems like modern Americans depend more on work for socialization than ever before. That is probably not a good thing, especially since modern professionals job hop more than ever. A…

Sure, but I’d like to have friends at work and friends outside of work. Nothing wrong with job hopping either: if you make a good friend, you’ll keep on connecting even after you switch jobs.

I’m not sure why everyone is interpreting me as having said “having friends at work is bad”. That’s obviously a silly statement, which is why I didn’t make it.

Depending on work for socialization is bad. That’s what I’m arguing against.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#515

Post by sidlls »

joelbluminator wrote: post #380
ianai wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder whether WFH will make work more ‘marginal value-add’ - it’s probably far easier to hire/fire someone remote than an office setting, for instance. Maybe some work will start to resemble Uber more than traditional work?

If I understand what you mean I totally agree; remote work isn't good for say developers who mostly got by by being good politicians. We probably all worked with people like that. You will be judged more by your actual output than by how well you give presentations or get along with bosses. On the other hand it's terrific for people who got pushed out of the job market due to ageism or other biases. It matters less w…

Being judged by what kind of output? At my current employer it matters very much that you get stuff done. It matters to a much lesser degree whether what you got done is actually (as opposed to being perceived to be) useful or impactful.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#516

Post by sokoloff »

tjpnz wrote: post #352
jjav wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My workspace is also superior to what I'd ever get in the office. An interesting factor is how this is dependent on how confident we can be to continue WFH. Like many people, I'm nowhere near prepared to have a good home office, the house is way too tiny. Which was fine when I didn't WFH more than a few days a month. But I could easily solve that by moving to a cheaper area where I could get a house with enough spa…

>An interesting factor is how this is dependent on how confident we can be to continue WFH. I had this problem and spent a few months working on the couch before buying a desk and office chair - I dropped a few thousand on these things alone. What gave me the confidence was the introduction of a WFH allowance and news a few people around the company had moved to the countryside.

A few thousand on just a desk and a chair? I’m left thinking that desk must be amazing!

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#517

Post by DonutAtwork »

It should because honestly, why not if it could make employees more productive. Yes, only if they could be more productive. Although WFH will more likely become a hybrid rather than full WFH as work commitments always demand some sort of work outside.

I do agree with what this articles' final outcomes although largely much of it will depend on demographic culture, beliefs of management etc. as well.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#518

Post by jansan »

user3939382 wrote: post #499
troydavis wrote: post #484

I'm a little disappointed at the percentage of comments which extrapolate personal anecdotes into societal behavior, and without addressing the data in this study - even to poke holes in the methodology, which is totally fair game (though IMO quite good, especially for what they had to work with). The whole point of a 15,000-person survey like this is so that we're not all stuck guessing based on our own experiences.…

I get the impression that these headlines are often treated as a writing prompt by commenters, independent of the linked content. Thanks for the quality analysis.

>I get the impression that these headlines are often treated as a writing prompt by commenters,

Welcome to the internet.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#519

Post by sokoloff »

ameister14 wrote: post #398
wisty wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's worth looking into "theory of the firm" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_the_firm Why should employees even exist? Shouldn't firms just sack everyone, then hire contractors? I often hear advocates of remote work talk about "presenteeism" and how managers need to just focus more on outputs. This is fine, but if they can do that why not sack everyone and just hire contractors and pay for the outpu…

>I often hear advocates of remote work talk about "presenteeism" and how managers need to just focus more on outputs. This is fine, but if they can do that why not sack everyone and just hire contractors and pay for the outputs? Why not do that anyway? The same reasons apply. >If they are at work, and can't slack off, then they will use this discretion to create value for the company in ways that the managers don't a…

Maybe and maybe not. My underlying direction is “do what’s best for the company”. If I see things wrongly and give you a more specific direction that you believe contradicts that (“don’t fix that bug!”), it will be well-received when you fix that bug.

Even if you spend some time chasing it and come up empty, the story that you went above what was assigned because you were convinced I was wrong and hurting the company is still a good one.

Now, if you always act like an arrow without any feathers, we may have a problem, but I’d way rather have a bunch of engineers trying to improve the company even if that means proving me wrong than have a bunch of them waiting to faithfully execute my divinely-inspired direction.

Re: Why Working from Home Will Stick [pdf]

#520

Post by ghaff »

troydavis wrote: post #511
ghaff wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I wish more studies delved into more--although, as you say, what people think today and what they'll actually do may be different--is the difference between part-time (even most-time) WFH and fully remote because that's actually a pretty big distinction. It might be the difference between having a very long commute one day a week and living in a mountain town or on the other side of the country.

Yes, that is a big distinction. Page 39 of this survey may shed some light on that question. Of those who WFH'ed at some point during COVID (essentially anyone who can WFH at all), they asked "In 2022+ (after COVID) how often would you like to have paid work days at home?". The answer set doesn't separate local-only from living anywhere, but it does list 5 days/week as its own answer.

I did see that and, yes, it was a fairly high percentage. But, as you say, it doesn't really distinguish default to WFH from having to get on a plane to come into the office. It's perhaps suggestive that if you want to WFH 5 days a week there's an implication is that it doesn't really matter where you live (domestically, or at least within a timezone or two) but they're not necessarily the same thing.
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