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German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

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Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#261

Post by ChrisRR »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #254
martin_a wrote: post #70

"the largest market" always reminds me of "Bin Ladens right hand". Obviously the next one becomes the largest, but nevertheless it's like they kill at least one of those markets a month. Probably legalizing weed would stop most of that more effectively than all those police operations after month of preparation.

True but please don't stop on weed, please also liberalize non-narcotic prescription medications availability to let people buy whatever they know they need without having to visit a doctor.

This wouldn't happen. Even from a pharmaceutical company's viewpoint, their regulatory body comes down on them like a ton of bricks if too many people suffer injury from their products.

So pharmaceutical companies and other medical product manufacturers manage their risk by only selling to approved suppliers, so that they don't have people randomly putting themselves at risk using their products.

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#262

Post by pksebben »

jariel wrote: post #247
that_guy_iain wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wow, you're not using your imagination well enough to recognize how ubiquitously widespread opioid addiction would be were it integrated into our coffee, soft-drinks, an aperatif with dinner etc.. It would be a massive, ongoing public health crisis. That would never happen. People literally wouldn't buy the products enmass because they don't want to sit around drooping all day. > Finally - if Tobacco is really in t…

"wouldn't buy the products the products enmass because they don't want to sit around drooping all day." Yes they would (!) and we already know why: it's extremely addictive . We have ample evidence from the ongoing Opioid Crisis that people who get 'too many pills' from an operation can and do become very addicted and 'do it all day'. Have a look here [1] from the Economist. What does that look like? It looks like 'C…

The thing that caused the opioid crisis was doctors and Purdue pharma. Some folks are bad at handling addictive substances, and they were prescribed these things.

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#263

Post by dcolkitt »

cm2187 wrote: post #118

I get how these market places are used for digital goods (malware, credit cards), but I don’t understand how people can trade physical goods on those. If they have to exchange products, they must either meet in person or use the mail, either is trackable by the authorities. I see how the seller can protect himself for local transactions. He could leave the goods hidden somewhere and tell the buyer where to go. But th…

USPS domestic mail requires a warrant to open.

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#264

Post by pksebben »

the-dude wrote: post #213
nerbert wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rat park comes to mind. The issues are not the drugs, but our well being in society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_Park#Replication

I want rat park to be true. It's depressing that it's not been effectively replicated. That said, it's conclusions are sort of common sense; if you give people options and one of them feels better than the rest they will take it, so give them more good options. It's almost as if rats aren't subject to market forces...

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#265

Post by pksebben »

SirSourdough wrote: post #245
jokethrowaway wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised you don't get constantly hassled by sketchy people on the street trying to sell you drugs. Also, homeless people everywhere often know who to ask or where to go.

I hope we can agree that there's a significant difference in accessibility for something you can legally buy from the store versus something that you have to seek out illegally from random "sketchy people on the street".

changing accessibility doesn't mean less use.

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#266

Post by npiit »

martin_a wrote: post #70

"the largest market" always reminds me of "Bin Ladens right hand". Obviously the next one becomes the largest, but nevertheless it's like they kill at least one of those markets a month. Probably legalizing weed would stop most of that more effectively than all those police operations after month of preparation.

>"the largest market" always reminds me of "Bin Ladens right hand"

People need promotion.

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#268

Post by pksebben »

jariel wrote: post #196
hummusman wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the crux here is that decriminalising/legalising the use of drugs such as heroin would not make them more widespread and ubiquitous. Despite being illegal they are still so very easy to access in almost all countries, and most people are well aware of the high risks associated with them. Legalising them would bring users/abusers into a more public sphere where it is far easier to access harm reduction and the…

The laws of supply and demand would indicate otherwise. If you make something easier to access - either by reduced price, more contact, reduced social stigma - people will consume more of it, straight up. Think of it like a social disease that has an R0/R1 that communicates itself much like COVID. Kids how absolutely don't know anyone who's ever done Heroin, are unlikely to ever even have the thought, let alone, try…

the teenage users of marijuana in Amsterdam might argue against that. This sort of simple logic doesn't actually hold up in practice, because the world is complex and not simple.

If you go out of your way to tell people that "drugs are bad and will kill you", and then those people find out you lied (see: every drug PSA ever), they may be inclined to seek proof, whereas they wouldn't have bothered if it weren't taboo

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#269

Post by shuckles »

rtisdale wrote: post #244
brazzy wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But note that all those statement are about the amount of harm in an environment where alcohol is legal, cheaply available in every supermarket, widely advertized, and its consumption socially accepted, even expected . Can you really say in good conscience that other drugs wouldn't be worse if they became equally ubiquitous?

This was relevant to the parent post as well as your own comment. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-11660210 A UK study led by a panel of experts analyzed a number of recreational drugs and evaluated them across 16 different criteria. Alcohol was one of the most dangerous drugs and was unique in that it was the only drug that posed more risk to society than it did for the actual user. This is of course, not definitive proo…

What is their definition of harm to others? Meth addicts can be very violent yet this study says they pose little risk.

Re: German police take down 'world's largest darknet marketplace'

#270

Post by ThrustVectoring »

pksebben wrote: post #258
qwerty456127 wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you really say in good conscience that other drugs wouldn't be worse if they became equally ubiquitous? I'm sure that in general people on weed, shrooms, DMT or MDMA are much much less prone to violent aggression and destructive behaviour than drunk people. I'm also sure all of these but the last do much less (if any) harm to your health than alcohol does. The only drugs I know which can be considered as or mor…

Ahem. A couple addendums, if I may: LSD has no measurable long term side effects - the myth that it makes people go crazy came out of the fact that our can make you feel crazy. Kratom is not an opioid. to qualify as an opioid, you must be derived from opium. Cocaine is not nearly as dangerous as alcohol. It is, perhaps, easier to indulge in cocaine to excess, but people on it are not nearly as likely to do things tha…

> LSD has no measurable long term side effects

IIRC it permanently increases the big-5 personality trait Openness

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