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Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

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181–190 of 366 posts

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#181

I kind of wonder if we're looking at solving this the wrong way. Instead of mandating that manufacturers take specific steps to fix the waste problem, maybe it would be better to tag items at manufacture and charge device makers a percentage based on how long before it enters the waste stream. Manufacturers could solve this by either: - Making their things easy to repair - Creating in house recycling programs - Makin…

Making the producers responsible for the disposal might be the best way. I don't exactly know how it would be implemented but I'd like to see it for packaging too. Local authorities should be able to collect up all Mcdonalds packaging and hand it back to them. Make them responsible for its disposal. Then they will be incentivised to reduce the amount of packaging that they produce.

> Local authorities should be able to collect up all Mcdonalds packaging and hand it back to them.

Yes, with a bill for the cost of collection and at some point (after repeated failures?), a fine to motivate a course correction.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#182
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carrier locks are an absolute scam. The argument is that it allows carriers to offer subsidised phones and “repossess” them if the customer defaults on their bill by making it unusable. However, in reality, not only does the carrier not mind if the phone keeps being used (as long as it’s on the carrier’s network) but the lock doesn’t expire once the customer pays off their plan. Furthermore the process for unlocking…

Absolutely. Remember the "2014 Obama Unlocking Law" [1] ? It was supposed to not only not make it ilegal to carrier unlock a phone, but also forced all carriers to adopt a specific code of conduct to assist users with unlocking. Fast forward 6 years, and it is much harder to unlock a phone than it was then. The whole thing backfired for consumers. It was actually easier to unlock a phone in a "non-legal" way before t…

> This mainly applies to US carriers (in the US and Latam), and there certainly are exceptions in Europe where EVERY cell phone is unlocked from day one, regardless of your contractual status.

I had no idea this was still a thing, it’s horrible. What mechanism is creating the current situation? Phones are all unlocked here in New Zealand.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#183
They need to also demand "design for reparability". I had a dryer where to replace a thermal fuse, you had to remove all the outer panels and a bunch of other things to replace a tiny component. They could implemented a service panel on the back which you could unscrew to replace that part.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#184

I strongly prefer to repair devices and am reluctant to throw any broken manufactured good out, even when I have poor prospects of repairing them. Instead, I just hold on to them. Phones, stereos, vacuum cleaners, clocks, computers. My shelves are full of broken items, and good intentions, frozen in amber. Why do I think like this? I think it is a psychological condition. It isn't a rational choice. If I apply my edu…

> I think it is a psychological condition. People can have trouble letting go of obsoleted, unneeded object due to some emotional attachment. [Unless you hoard socially acceptable items, like status symbols or plain money, in that case most people will not see the problem] > an espresso machine ... performs twice as well as an equivalent device from 50 years ago ...or not. A rational reason for fixing stuff is that m…

[deleted]

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#185
In my opinion, if they really cared about their stated goals, the EPA should have also rolled right-to-repair protections for the relevant equipment into emissions rules for car manufacturers. They should have mandated interchangeable parts, standard connections, and openly available documentation.

Recently I rebuilt a 1996 car. The previous owner had misplaced a fuel tank topper that contained valving for the emissions controls. The parts needed were simply not available for purchase from the manufacturer or the aftermarket. At the time I couldn't source a used fuel tank for the 96, but I was able to find a 1999 model year of the same car in a junkyard.

Between 1996 and 1999, the fuel vapor emissions controls went from "somewhat complicated" to "really complicated." In theory I should have been able to either hook up just the plumbing needed by the 96 system, or upgrade the whole car to the 99 system. However in practice I could do neither. The fittings had all changed. The charcoal canister was changed from round to square. (And really what is the point of installing either canister when both are probably "used up" at this point? Why can't I buy new canisters at the same stores where I can buy new air filters?)

But the biggest impediment was obtaining information on the two systems. The information in the service manual was perfunctory and nonspecific; multiple different systems had been used in different years and regions. The diagrams of internal valving on the tank toppers small enough that important connections (or lack of them) were obscured by smudges. I had more luck reading EPA whitepapers to at least get a theory of operation.

In the enthusiast community I can find information about how to put a cylinder head from one year of this car onto a block from another. I can even find information about what ports to block off or drill open to remount the cylinder head on BACKWARDS, if I'm so inclined. There's not a similar subcommunity for people trying to repair their emissions equipment.

A similar problem exists with safety equipment. Most enthusiasts of this car just delete their ABS, or they never service it. I want to rebuild mine (this just consists of replacing internal O-rings), but I can't find information or get parts except from overseas. In Europe and other countries that are not the USA, the manufacturer did service and rebuild these ABS units.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#186
post #178

I kind of wonder if we're looking at solving this the wrong way. Instead of mandating that manufacturers take specific steps to fix the waste problem, maybe it would be better to tag items at manufacture and charge device makers a percentage based on how long before it enters the waste stream. Manufacturers could solve this by either: - Making their things easy to repair - Creating in house recycling programs - Makin…

Your suggested strategy isn't mutually exclusive - consumers could have the right to repair and manufacturers could be billed based on the value (negative or positive) of waste material that they generate.

What I'm suggesting is the problem isn't repairability, its stuff breaking and getting tossed.

I don't care how manufacturers address this issue, but I do think it's clearly their responsibility to address it.

Also, any legislation should recognize that these devices aren't just physical devices that might need to have a screen replaces. A device which you can replace the screen on, but can't get secure software for is just as worthless as one you can upgrade but can't replace the screen on.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#187
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Phone unlocking doesn't get much attention, but it is an integral part that no one wants to address or get their hands dirty with. There are many more locked phones in drawers or acting as mere paperweights than people actually care to disclose. Several years back we ran a poll to understand lifetime recycling habits. People aren't proud of dropping a phone and shattering the screen, but they are less proud of having…

Carrier locks are an absolute scam. The argument is that it allows carriers to offer subsidised phones and “repossess” them if the customer defaults on their bill by making it unusable. However, in reality, not only does the carrier not mind if the phone keeps being used (as long as it’s on the carrier’s network) but the lock doesn’t expire once the customer pays off their plan. Furthermore the process for unlocking…

> “repossess” them if the customer defaults

It's not usually like that - and I've had a few locked phones.

Usually the deal is that a network, say Vodafone, subsidises the handset by £50 of some such in return for you being forced to use Vodafone services for a couple of years, unless you arrange to unlock it.

It's sort of ok as a deal but a pain in many ways if you want to travel and use a local SIM or sell the phone for example.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#188

I kind of wonder if we're looking at solving this the wrong way. Instead of mandating that manufacturers take specific steps to fix the waste problem, maybe it would be better to tag items at manufacture and charge device makers a percentage based on how long before it enters the waste stream. Manufacturers could solve this by either: - Making their things easy to repair - Creating in house recycling programs - Makin…

I suppose there would be some regulatory agency that takes samples and estimates the number of items disposed, and then levies the costs?

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#189
post #109
post #5

I can't describe how much I hope something comes out of it. Not because I have some illusion of this tackling corporate greed, or helping the environment - devices will likely become more expensive and bulkier as a result, supply chain of replacement parts is generating heaps of waste too. I simply am surrounded by tens and hundreds of sort-of-broken devices that don't force me to replace yet, but are not fixable eit…

I just had my 4000€ MacBook Pro (2017) die, 5 months out of warranty, because of a blown capacitor. (probably a $0.20 part tops) They have to change the whole motherboard, lose all my data. Price of a new machine... grumble, grumble

Go with third-party repair. It's cheap and fast.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#190
post #109
post #5

I can't describe how much I hope something comes out of it. Not because I have some illusion of this tackling corporate greed, or helping the environment - devices will likely become more expensive and bulkier as a result, supply chain of replacement parts is generating heaps of waste too. I simply am surrounded by tens and hundreds of sort-of-broken devices that don't force me to replace yet, but are not fixable eit…

I just had my 4000€ MacBook Pro (2017) die, 5 months out of warranty, because of a blown capacitor. (probably a $0.20 part tops) They have to change the whole motherboard, lose all my data. Price of a new machine... grumble, grumble

Sounds like a job for Louis Rossman:

https://www.youtube.com/user/rossmanngroup/videos

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