Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#701

Post by treeman79 » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:19 AM UTC

Tokkemon wrote: post #524

jpttsn wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I very rarely hear this hope expressed and I struggle to believe it—can you elaborate?

I don't doubt that so many people on the right are hurting. Their constant accusations of being called the "fly-over states" is totally true. There is endless rural decay, industry is gone. When life is difficult like that, it is very easy to pine for a time gone past when things were better. But now it's gotten so bad that people are desperate. COVID-19 has made it much worse, and people don't want to follow restric…

Missing a couple of points.

Trump is a fighter. For many he fights for them.

He has been attacked mercilessly for years. To an absurd level.

Every republican has been attacked constantly. Until now, they have all been wimps. Bushes barely pushed on any issues.

The next republican is going to have 95% negative Media coverage. The actual reasons will be figured out later

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#702

Post by enneff » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:19 AM UTC

lr4444lr wrote: post #670

jmknoll wrote: post #542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really that implausible that half the population isn't willing to think critically about a nuanced problem, or to accept evidence that contradicts their desired narrative? Statistics aren't always reliable, but somewhere around 1/3 of American adults believe that climate change is a hoax, and evolution is a lie.

Fine, but do their hair-brained ideas and failure to think critically merit shutting them out of public discourse?

They're clearly not shut out. There are major news outlets that represent them, and their voices are heard loud and clear all over the internet. One of them was elected president FFS.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#703

Post by handedness » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:20 AM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #676

handedness wrote: post #642

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Slave_rebellions_in_t...

How did each of those work out for the slaves?

Well, for some of them, pretty darned well. A lot better than for their slaveowners, at least.

Anyway, I'm not sure what your point is. Mine was that a lot happened before the 1960s, and much of it wasn't pretty.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#704

Post by scruple » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:21 AM UTC

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #526

botwriter wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does the left have to censor the right? Surely they should be able to beat the right with logical and reasoned arguments? Censorship has always struck me as a tool that a side which isn't confident in its arguments uses.

A significant number of people are threatened by rational critical thinking. They instill these values in their children who then they go off on raving rampages touting false patriotism. You can't make them listen. Taking away their echo chambers is the only way to cool them off.

> You can't make them listen

Daryl Davis has certainly proven otherwise, but I freely admit that no one should have to have the sort of patience or dedication to the cause that he's demonstrated in doing so.

> What I have come to find to be the greatest and most effective and successful weapon that we can use, known to man, to combat such adversaries as ignorance, racism, hatred, violence, is also the least expensive weapon, and the one that is the least used by Americans. That weapon is called communication. [0] [1]

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daryl_Davis

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fw0vS0qvYo0&t=34s

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#705

Post by burnte » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:21 AM UTC

nicbou wrote: post #153

bjtitus wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Their legal cases are rejected. The mainstream media refuses to take them seriously. Well these last two seem pretty par for the course for illegitimate claims been promoted as legitimate. At a certain point the line of absurdity has been crossed at it is not the duty of society to constantly debunk illegitimate claims. > The other side keeps deplatforming them In this particular case, Parler has been host to a num…

Yes, that is what reddit, twitter and Hacker News reinforce constantly. It's either because it's true, or because the other side has been repeatedly discouraged from adding their two cents in those communities. I've been seeing the world through this lens for so long that I can't tell. I find it somewhat implausible that half the population is dumb, racist and all those other labels. It seems much more likely that I…

> or because the other side has been repeatedly discouraged from adding their two cents in those communities.

They have been discouraged from making threats, being racist, etc. If that is their two cents, it's not worth two cents. If they can't have a civil discussion without threats, racism, bigotry, etc, again, it's not worth two cents. This is they key, they KEEP coming back with vile speech. No one deplatforms them for simply having DIFFERENT opinions, they're deplatformed for having violent, racist, bigoted opinions. You can't equate silencing dissent from not tolerating hate speech.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#706

Post by burnte » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:22 AM UTC

lr4444lr wrote: post #670

jmknoll wrote: post #542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really that implausible that half the population isn't willing to think critically about a nuanced problem, or to accept evidence that contradicts their desired narrative? Statistics aren't always reliable, but somewhere around 1/3 of American adults believe that climate change is a hoax, and evolution is a lie.

Fine, but do their hair-brained ideas and failure to think critically merit shutting them out of public discourse?

If they can't stop threatening people, yes.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#707

Post by koolba » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:22 AM UTC

jessaustin wrote: post #691

SR2Z wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are against open borders? Then you’re a racist. Find me one Democrat with actual power advocating for open borders. And it's not as if the speech used by xenophobes is free of racial overtones and dogwhistles, either. > Are against abortion? Then you’re a misogynist. If you are against a woman's right to do what they please to their own body, you have to give compelling evidence for why. There is no such evidence.…

... a word that historically was used by people who started a lot of wars... That's us. USA starts lots of wars. We've still got, what, seven going right now? Maybe it's down to six? (Ummm... Iraq Afghanistan Syria Yemen Korea Palestine Iran well that's at least seven but I'm probably missing multiple wars in Africa...)

Yep. And the one President in decades that hasn't started any is apparently the war monger.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#708

Post by treeman79 » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:23 AM UTC

jessaustin wrote: post #652

nnspired wrote: post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no going back. It is because the “winning” side is actively doing their best to demonize everyone who doesn’t fit into their mold. So much for reconciling differences.

Republicans will take back both houses of Congress in two years. So, the overblown rhetoric that Democrats have to stage in order to hide the fact that they are basically Republican by most policy measures ("why don't we have affordable healthcare like other nations have, especially in a pandemic?" "Because fasciststs!1!") only has to last until then.

So long as mass mail in ballots is a thing. No republican is going to trust the system.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#709

Post by caconym_ » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:23 AM UTC

brighton36 wrote: post #437

caconym_ wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is “the other route”? They are being deplatformed because their speech is violent and damaging—in many cases it’s literal incitement to violence. Their legal cases are being rejected because they have no legal merit. The mainstream media refuse to take them seriously because they have again and again shown themselves to be bad faith actors, peddlers of unsubstantiated conspiracy, outright liars, and so on. I don…

What makes the legal route legitimate is a negotiation in society. If the legal route is rescinded, then, the courts will be considered illegitimate. Perhaps that's right. But, that's also how revolutions start.

The legal system is certainly a flawed creation of man, but it isn't a magic wand. I'd go so far as to say that most legal systems, extant and otherwise, won't (absent corruption) serve as a vehicle for you to do literally whatever you want. I'm not a lawyer, but I get a strong impression that the Trump campaign's attempts to have the election results invalidated or reversed in various jurisdictions were in that vein, and literally laughable.

I agree that revolutions are real, that many have happened in the past, and presumably more will in the future.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#710

Post by burnte » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 3:23 AM UTC

scruple wrote: post #704

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A significant number of people are threatened by rational critical thinking. They instill these values in their children who then they go off on raving rampages touting false patriotism. You can't make them listen. Taking away their echo chambers is the only way to cool them off.

> You can't make them listen Daryl Davis has certainly proven otherwise, but I freely admit that no one should have to have the sort of patience or dedication to the cause that he's demonstrated in doing so. > What I have come to find to be the greatest and most effective and successful weapon that we can use, known to man, to combat such adversaries as ignorance, racism, hatred, violence, is also the least expensive…

Incorrect, you CAN NOT make someone listen, you can only take advantage when they are willing to do so. No one will believe anything they're not willing to. If they open the door, only then does communication work.