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Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

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Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#671

Post by macinjosh »

rootusrootus wrote: post #641
nicbou wrote: post #11

Someone brought an interesting perspective in another thread and I can't shake it off. The other side keeps deplatforming them. Their legal cases are rejected. The mainstream media refuses to take them seriously. We're not even listening to them, because it's science and they're *ists if they disagree. We're not debating anymore. We just assume we're right. We are slowly squeezing a significant segment of the populat…

I'll be honest -- I haven't really seen any cases where someone was deplatformed for a legitimate political view. By that I mean a viewpoint that is at least tolerant, if nothing else. If the argument against deplatforming is that people should be allowed to heap hatred on gay people or other minorities, then it's not a particularly strong argument. Maybe this is just inherent to a conservative viewpoint, I don't kno…

You get to decide what a ‘legitimate political view’ is? That’s rich.

This is so tone deaf.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#672

Post by handedness »

Quinner wrote: post #525
nicbou wrote: post #11

Someone brought an interesting perspective in another thread and I can't shake it off. The other side keeps deplatforming them. Their legal cases are rejected. The mainstream media refuses to take them seriously. We're not even listening to them, because it's science and they're *ists if they disagree. We're not debating anymore. We just assume we're right. We are slowly squeezing a significant segment of the populat…

Five years ago civil society was in general agreement that racism was bad and that we should respect the democratic process instead of seeking to violently overthrow it. Of course there were people who disagreed but they were at the margins and their voices were isolated to a few forums most people never heard of. A demagogue came along and used mass media platforms to destabilize the norms of civil society and give…

You have a rosier view of five years ago than I do.

Anyway, demagogues are products of their respective times. To focus on them and their personalities and their rhetoric is to completely miss the forest.

Edit: In fact, that approach is part of what gives them their power. And it certainly makes avoiding their ascent nearly impossible.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#673

Post by caconym_ »

disgrunt wrote: post #649
caconym_ wrote: post #630

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of the cougar analogy is not to dehumanize anybody. It is to demonstrate that sometimes problems exist ( problems as in configurations of reality that can be articulated as bad ), and that doing nothing is often not the solution that will yield the greatest good in a utilitarian sense. I'm sorry if that wasn't clear. I'm curious, though—would you just let the cougar do its thing? Like, if that literally hap…

I reject your analogy on it's face as a banal attempt to justify incivility and barbarism towards those in which we disagree.

Okay. But if you want to imagine I'm making a point I'm not making and respond to that rather than the point I am making, could you do it offline in a Word doc or something? There's already a lot of noise in this thread.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#674

Post by secondcoming »

Tokkemon wrote: post #524
jpttsn wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I very rarely hear this hope expressed and I struggle to believe it—can you elaborate?

I don't doubt that so many people on the right are hurting. Their constant accusations of being called the "fly-over states" is totally true. There is endless rural decay, industry is gone. When life is difficult like that, it is very easy to pine for a time gone past when things were better. But now it's gotten so bad that people are desperate. COVID-19 has made it much worse, and people don't want to follow restric…

> My optimistic hope is that with a few years of widespread governance by the Democratic party, we may see some wide-reaching assistance reach these people. Get education reformed, get police reformed.

Aren't there areas in the US that have been governed by Democrats continuously for decades, yet also don't have the programs you list above?

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#675

Post by selfishgene »

gnusty_gnurc wrote: post #356
caconym_ wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is “the other route”? They are being deplatformed because their speech is violent and damaging—in many cases it’s literal incitement to violence. Their legal cases are being rejected because they have no legal merit. The mainstream media refuse to take them seriously because they have again and again shown themselves to be bad faith actors, peddlers of unsubstantiated conspiracy, outright liars, and so on. I don…

> They are being deplatformed because their speech is violent and damaging—in many cases it’s literal incitement to violence. "in defense of looting" And while I'm at it - why isn't China being deplatformed? They literally just posted on their embassy twitter account saying they fixed minority women who were "baby-making machines." One can only guess they mean sterilization. It's obvious who's allowed to be inhumane…

Don't forget about Saudi Arabia!

Their "Crown Prince" assassinates a dissident journalist by placing a plastic bag over his head to suffocate him while his fiance waits outside the embassy in her car.

And leaders like president Rafael Reif at MIT invite this brutal dictator onto the MIT campus in order to thank him for his donation to the Media Lab in a photo op covered by the newspapers, presumably as a form of reputation laundering and because Rafael Reif cares about human rights about as much as he cares about the sexual abuse of 12 year-old girls.

Why is the Crown Prince's violence "more legitimate" than folks who perhaps mistakenly think the election was stolen from them and feel the need to break a few windows in order to protest the ballot count?

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#676

Post by throw0101a »

handedness wrote: post #642
throw0101a wrote: post #638

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We are slowly squeezing a significant segment of the population out of public debate, and they are powerless to stop it. Is it surprising that they are furious about it, and explode in unpredictable ways? Wouldn't you do the same? What did African-Americans do when they were marginalized for a century until the Civil Rights era of the 1960s? (And still are in many ways.) The folks you are referring to can say whate…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Slave_rebellions_in_t...

How did each of those work out for the slaves?

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#677

Post by buzzert »

yuchi wrote: post #289
mlyle wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, that's just rewording Evelyn Hall's restatement of Voltaire, isn't it? "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

Completely unaware of. Thank you. Once again my ignorance shines.

But it sounds beautiful in Italian, so thanks for sharing :)

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#678

Post by lliamander »

Terretta wrote: post #533
nicbou wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that is what reddit, twitter and Hacker News reinforce constantly. It's either because it's true, or because the other side has been repeatedly discouraged from adding their two cents in those communities. I've been seeing the world through this lens for so long that I can't tell. I find it somewhat implausible that half the population is dumb, racist and all those other labels. It seems much more likely that I…

> I find it implausible half the population is dumb Half the population is dumber than average.

It's highly improbable that the right wind of politics solely resides within the lower half of the bell curve, or that there is even a strong correlation.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#679

Post by jgwil2 »

LetsPlayNice wrote: post #516
nicbou wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that is what reddit, twitter and Hacker News reinforce constantly. It's either because it's true, or because the other side has been repeatedly discouraged from adding their two cents in those communities. I've been seeing the world through this lens for so long that I can't tell. I find it somewhat implausible that half the population is dumb, racist and all those other labels. It seems much more likely that I…

I appreciate your honesty and I will attempt to explain, briefly, so you might understand better. 1. Most people on the right are against abortion for the reason that it is against their particular religion, which declares it as murder and murder is wrong. But, the others don't care at all about a woman's right to choose, they just don't want their tax dollars paying for that choice instead of other things they want.…

And yet if we look at it objectively, the right is clearly overrepresnted in our political system. Republicans lost the popular vote in five of the last six presidential elections. In the next presidential election there will be many eligible voters who weren't even born last time they won. The Senate gives a seven point advantage to Republicans. So please, explain to me where you get this idea that the right is "treated unfairly," because it's getting very hard to see how this argument is being made in good faith.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#680

Post by rsynnott »

dcolkitt wrote: post #408
andy_ppp wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the problem is this; I’m not interested in what someone who is dumb enough to storm the Capitol building has to say. And they aren’t interested in having a debate on the facts either, so what are we going to discuss? I don’t get how we can come together and make this better...

Honest question: Who do you consider the smartest Trump supporter? Do you think you have anything to learn from them by engaging in a good faith discussion? My point being maybe you think 95% of MAGA-hats are off their rocker, and Trumpism taken as a whole is grossly misguided. I don't really disagree. But is it possible that there's some core nugget of wisdom to take away. Something, perhaps that your current worldv…

> Who do you consider the smartest Trump supporter?

Depends how you define supporter. He’s received support from some smart, cynical and extremely nasty people; he serves their agenda, one way or another. But they’re not fans; they’re probably privately pretty contemptuous of him. The Mercers would be an obvious example.

If by supporter you mean the people who believe him about the election being stolen and so on, there are no smart people in that category. There are smart sociopaths who don’t believe him but go along with the idea, of course.

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