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Introducing the next generation of Mac

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Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#971

Post by bartvk »

ajharrison wrote: post #631
justin66 wrote: post #457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps this pricing was brought about by the same head injury that caused someone in management to believe 8GB is an adequate base spec for RAM in 2020.

Seriously though what’s the connection between it being 2020 and there being more default RAM? Are you suggesting that in the year 2030 we should expect 100gb of RAM? The goal shouldn’t be to increase ageing technology but to replace it with something better.

I think I'm with you here.

I've had 16 gigs for the last 8 years. I thought about getting 32, but I haven't noticed needing more memory and it does use (battery) energy so I decided against it.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#972

Post by lovelyviking »

saagarjha wrote: post #957
lovelyviking wrote: post #933

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is intended. They should stop selling things that attack privacy and freedom of a person, or this concept is not your priority and you are ok to have computer controlled COMPLETELY by someone else, which means ZERO privacy? PS: Well, this one is downvoted too. Looks like some lost even a sense of what PERSONAL computer means. OK. Keep downvoting! it's a good strategy to silence someone when there are no valid ar…

They’ll stop selling the device to you or accepting your returns. So you haven’t really done much. Also, people who complain about downvotes usually attract more. I’d suggest not doing that. Claims that there are “no valid arguments” against your position rather than nobody wanting to deal with you are, well, absurd.

If many people will do that it's a different story. May be it's ok with you and you see no danger in their strategy but I see this issue as huge attack on freedom and rights, including right for privacy. History have many examples about how people protected their rights and freedom. Returning product is very light way to send a proper message.

Recently I see more and more perfectly valid comments to be downvoted and I do not like it. If this forum will become mob controlled with bullying then I see no reason why bright people would stay here. If one doesn't want ot deal with comment, usually one moves on, like I do. But if argument is perfectly valid and instead of answer I see one simply downvotes it is bullying as it appears.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#973

Post by bartvk »

marcolussetti wrote: post #811
lostgame wrote: post #708

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a market for aftermarket coolers on laptops universally - I sometimes see laptops on those fan pads?

I wonder how useful they are. I used to have a gaming laptop in the early 2010s and the nicest cooling fan I could find, but it only dropped the temperature down by 2-3 degrees

My suspicion is that they're not useful at all. Once I bought such a cooler pad, and placed a 2011 13" MacBook on it. Then I benchmarked it (i.e. max out the CPU), and measured the sensor "CPU Near". I could not measure a difference between the cooler pad on or off.

I can't remember the brand of the cooler pad, but it had two 10 cm fans.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#974

Post by wukerplank »

skavi wrote: post #834
wukerplank wrote: post #802

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On paper the new Macs seem like Raspberry Pis with a fancy case and display.

There’s a fairly significant performance difference between Apple’s new cores and the Pi 4’s A72s. If you ignore that and the high-end display, touchpad, and keyboard, then I suppose it’s not too far off from a Pi in a fancy case, but then you could say the same for any laptop.

The specs that irk me are RAM and SSD, even more since they started soldering them on. CPU & GPU were always kinda on par with the rest of the field.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#975

Post by vbezhenar »

saagarjha wrote: post #966
vbezhenar wrote: post #964

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's WWDC talk claiming that you can't: https://youtu.be/Hg9F1Qjv3iU?t=3772 I'm talking about ARM macs, not Intel ones.

That’s not really what I’d call a “WWDC talk”, but sure, it mentions that Apple won’t provide Boot Camp, and that they are running their OS demos using virtualization. I didn’t see a claim that they won’t let you reduce the boot security.

"We're not direct booting an alternate operating system, it's purely virtualization. Hypervisors can be very efficient, so the need to direct boot shouldn't really be a concern."

For me that quote means that they're not allowing booting any alternate operating system and they expect developers to use virtualization if other operating system is needed. I would be happy to be wrong about that.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#976

Post by fastball »

dawnerd wrote: post #391
fastball wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You run two 4k screens and the laptop screen itself from an existing 13" laptop?

Yes. Current apple intel specs for the 13 read: "Up to two external 4K displays with 4096-by-2304 resolution at 60Hz at millions of colors"

Including the laptop's screen?

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#977

Post by saagarjha »

vbezhenar wrote: post #975
saagarjha wrote: post #966

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not really what I’d call a “WWDC talk”, but sure, it mentions that Apple won’t provide Boot Camp, and that they are running their OS demos using virtualization. I didn’t see a claim that they won’t let you reduce the boot security.

"We're not direct booting an alternate operating system, it's purely virtualization. Hypervisors can be very efficient, so the need to direct boot shouldn't really be a concern." For me that quote means that they're not allowing booting any alternate operating system and they expect developers to use virtualization if other operating system is needed. I would be happy to be wrong about that.

I understood that as "we weren't booting something else in our demos, we were using virtualization" but not "we can't boot anything else". I am sure, however, that they would like you to use virtualization instead of direct booting.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#978

Post by sudosysgen »

wil421 wrote: post #921
lhl wrote: post #824

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worth noting that they are charging $200 for the 8GB memory upgrade. The spot price for 16GB of LPDDR4 looks like it's currently ~$8 per DRAMexchange: https://www.dramexchange.com/ They're also charging $200 for a 256GB storage upgrade - spot price of 3D TLC is $3/256Gb ($24 for 256GB) - you can currently buy a 256GB NVMe SSD (full stick with controller) at retail for <$30 as well.

That is like saying the materials the baker needs to bake bread cost 5¢. Why doesn’t the baker price his bread at 5¢?

Well, no. Apple buys RAM chips at that price, and they just have to swap one chip for another. The differential in price from one to the other including all costs is that much. Labour costs and OpEx are not affected by choosing Chip A or Chip B that are essentially identical.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#979

Post by crazygringo »

Toutouxc wrote: post #893
jefftk wrote: post #699

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instead of having a camera as thin as the lid, they could have the camera stick out a little bit and fit into a recess on the other side of the clamshell when closed.

I'm almost sure they couldn't. I can't quite put my finger on it, but that's just not how Apple does things.

I know you're being snarky, but in all seriousness they'd need to make the touchpad smaller to make room for it.

And considering people LOVE Apple's huge and amazing trackpads... I would guess it wouldn't be a smart tradeoff.

Re: Introducing the next generation of Mac

#980

Post by maxioatic »

pierrefermat1 wrote: post #709
maxioatic wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. I just want 32GB and a 13" screen!

Please do explain what your workflow is that requires to you have so much RAM in such a small form factor with a severely limiting CPU and almost non existent GPU?

GPU: don't need it except to drive 1 or 2 external monitors if I'm at my desk (thus small screen not an issue either) CPU: 8 cores is fine for me RAM: mainly for a local dev environment running in Docker

For reference I currently have a 2019 16" MBP, with 64GB of RAM and an 8 core i9. Right now I'm using ~45GB of it, usually its up around 50 or 55. The CPU is at ~10%. While I'm developing locally, the workloads are highly bursty but sometimes they will chew up almost all of the CPU for about 10 minutes.

I used to have a 2016 15" MBP with 16GB (4 core i7) and while I could still run everything, the RAM was always pegged. Before that I had a 2016 13" MBP with 16GB (2 core i7) (I actually swapped with a coworker because I thought his 15" had 32GB). With both of these the RAM was by far the limiting factor, and while the increased CPU cores have been nice, most of the time I haven't noticed. The RAM increase on the other hand is always noticeable. Thus, 16GB is a nonstarter for me.

Edit: To add, I prefer the 13" form factor when I'm not at my desk.

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