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FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

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Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#51

Post by shawnz »

Gracana wrote: post #50
shawnz wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So to catalogue, your two issues are... - DPI scaling turned on by default on high dpi displays even though compatibility isn't perfect. Well, GTK DPI scaling certainly isn't perfect either to say the least. - Not sure where the settings are: Click "start" and click "settings". Forget about the legacy control panel as that is only there for compatibility with old software and for changing the settings of deprecated f…

I find that it's hard to successfully misrepresent what someone said when the original is right there for everyone to see .

What am I missing? The fact that it "used to just work" and now it's "worse than all the competitors" for no objective reason?

Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#52

Post by fullstop »

scaladev wrote: post #25
lmm wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FreeBSD feels more solid to me; upgrades are easier, and stuff changes less often. I don't have time to keep up with maintaining a Linux server any more.

What are you talking about? Put CentOS or Ubuntu LTS on your box and forget about it for the next ten years. The only updates you'll get are security and bug fixes, nothing fundamental will change. The next LTS release you'll install in 2030 will have substantial differences, but FreeBSD changes quite a bit too in such a large time span.

A few things..

1. Ubuntu LTS releases are supported for five years -- Centos is for ten years.

2. FreeBSD updates are typically easy to perform, and the new system is not that different from the previous one. Things are where they used to be and you configure it the same way as you have for years. With Centos, there was a migration from yum -> dnf. With both Ubuntu and Centos the init system has changed from sysv -> upstart -> systemd. The default network configuration on Ubuntu has been replaced with netplan.

I guess what I'm getting at is that there is significantly more churn in Linux distributions and vastly less churn in FreeBSD. This could also be seen as a lack of progress, but I don't think that OP sees it that way.

Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#53

Post by protomyth »

znpy wrote: post #44
louwrentius wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing to extinghuish, except for the notion of Linux on the desktop, that was never a thing anyway, except for a few technerds. Microsoft has indeed embraced Linux, in the context of Azure, they are making a ton of money thanks to Linux. And if people develop for Linux-based platforms, why not give them the tools?

> There is nothing to extinghuish, except for the notion of Linux on the desktop Thanks you proved my point

The ", that was never a thing anyway, except for a few technerds." was a pretty important part of the line you quoted.

Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#54

Post by cjaybo »

lproven wrote: post #46
whizzter wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MS doesn't care about Stallmans GNU goals. What they do care about are developers not being annoyed with working on a Windows machine (or nowadays using their Azure clouds). Speaking for myself, I'm coming from the gamedev world (lately webdev) and as such was mostly tied to windows due to various tools(Photoshop,Modo,3dsmax in the past,etc) but that didn't mean that I was going to suffer by using IIS or spend a fort…

This is _precisely_ the sort of thought the company wishes to cultivate: * That they don't care about Free Software (they do, it is a hated enemy). * That they are ignoring the FOSS world (they're watching it closely and working out how to stealthily attack it). * That they'll play nice and so should be welcomed (they are a merciless enemy to be constantly wary of). In other words, their marketing team's message of "…

What motive does MS have to "watch and stealthily attack" the FOSS world? Which parts of that world threaten their existence?

Looking at the last few quarterly reports, I'm inclined to agree with the parent commenter here, and your comment doesn't do much to substantiate your point as it stands.

Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#55

Post by lproven »

cjaybo wrote: post #54
lproven wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is _precisely_ the sort of thought the company wishes to cultivate: * That they don't care about Free Software (they do, it is a hated enemy). * That they are ignoring the FOSS world (they're watching it closely and working out how to stealthily attack it). * That they'll play nice and so should be welcomed (they are a merciless enemy to be constantly wary of). In other words, their marketing team's message of "…

What motive does MS have to "watch and stealthily attack" the FOSS world? Which parts of that world threaten their existence? Looking at the last few quarterly reports, I'm inclined to agree with the parent commenter here, and your comment doesn't do much to substantiate your point as it stands.

This is the motive, as someone cited before me:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguis...

I was merely agreeing.

Look at MS' history. It used this tactic to kill or maim a long list of companies: Netscape, Lotus, WordPerfect, Aldus, Novell, Sybase, STAC, Central Point Software, Quarterdeck, and dozens more.

It tried it with Sun and Java -- it failed, but only just.

It tried it with the WWW itself with ActiveX and IIS ASP. Again, this only just failed.

It has a long long history of being the nastiest, most deceitful, dishonest, back-stabbing company in the computer industry -- and that is saying a lot.

It is not a coincidence that Gates became the richest man in the world.

Cory Doctorow's Twitter summary is pretty good (short thread): https://twitter.com/doctorow/status/1304811968398729218

The LA Times did a great investigative piece on the Bill & Melinda Gates foundation _thirteen years ago_: https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2007-jan-07-na-gates...

TL;DR -- it spends just enough money that Gates & Buffett don't pay tax on the interest of their wealth; it does not do ethical investment of any kind; its objective is whitewashing the reputation of a retired criminal, in which it is very successful.

I have yet to see any evidence that the company culture that Gates created and Ballmer continued has changed in any substantive way.

Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#56

Post by hurrrrrrrr »

zeveb wrote: post #8
dividedbyzero wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, lots of shops begrudgingly support Linux laptops because a VM is a lot less practical, and the productivity hit would be substantial, probably, and forcing devs to make do with Windows only is bad for hiring. If WSL really works out, though, it might be the other way around – Linux on Windows might work really well, be able to do things Linux itself can't, like interfacing with Windows-only hardware, using Direc…

> Linux on Windows might work really well … and be the superior experience in total for lots of people. No, it will not and — without massive changes at Microsoft and in Windows — will never be. Source: have a Windows box, am repeatedly amazed at how bad it is. Seriously, it is embarrassing to use Windows. I think the only reason people enjoy it is the fact that they have not gotten a chance to really spend time in a…

> I think the only reason people enjoy it is the fact that they have not gotten a chance to really spend time in a good tiling window manager on X11/GNU/Linux.

I did and switched back to floating. AMA

Re: FreeBSD Can Now Be Built From Linux/macOS Hosts, Transition To Git Continues

#58

Post by patrec »

busterarm wrote: post #12
patrec wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a non-zero chance WSL will make desktop Linux completely irrelevant even for developers.

You underestimate most companies' (with significant internal engineering organizations) commitment to open source. It's been 8 years since I've even had to touch Windows professionally and without any overt effort on my part.

The only reason companies care about open source is because

a) it's cheaper b) avoids lock-in and other dependencies

I don't see either of these being much of an advantage for linux on the desktop, although they will continue to be on server and embedded.

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