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EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

politico.eu

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Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#311

Post by joejerryronnie »

jolux wrote: post #159
dragonwriter wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well, it’s pretty close to my salary. But I work in government. Sure. But it's probably nowhere close to your salary + benefits + overhead cost to your employer.

My benefits are lousy but the contractor I work for probably charges my employer, yes. 300 engineer years would still be quite a lot too.

Well, there are 2 models of SW development you can use here:

1) 30 top notch engineers to build the MVP and then iterate.

2) 300 engineers - the first 100 to step all over each other trying to build an app and the remaining 200 engineers fixing the bugs from the first 100.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#312

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

88840-8855 wrote: post #70
tachyonbeam wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You want your access to Google, Duckduckgo, YouTube, Uber, Facebook, Dropbox, Amazon, Netflix, etc to be blocked?

Yes. I want that. This would lead to a local tech scene, actually REALLY localised products (where you dont have to wait till google decides to roll out features in Germany after 7 years) and best of all: JOBS. This would lead to millions of jobs. It would make Europe super interesting for high skilled labor and bring a nice twist into the migration problem we are facing now. Yes, this would hurt America, but yeah...…

Hrrmpf. NEIN! That sounds like make work/Arbeitsbeschaffungsmaßnahme/bullshit jobs a la Graeber.

The reason for I(C)T to exist is to optimize until all those are gone! Otherwise you can go back to FAX, Phone, Post and paper files, and would probably more 'efficient' because of less friction between cybernetic fiction and factory floor.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#313

Post by joejerryronnie »

robertlagrant wrote: post #131
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the app was developed on time and works, thats fine. 60 million isn't that much in the grand scheme of government contracts. In a situation like this i would want a proven vendor, and pay premium over startups. UK has spent 11 billion on a healthcare IT system and got nothing to show for it. https://independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/hea...

It doesn't have nothing to show - lots of stuff did get usefully upgraded (thankfully) although of course nowhere near 11 billion's worth. It's the public sector commissioning the private sector in matters that it often doesn't understand. This will fail far more often than it will succeed.

It’s also the byzantine vendor sourcing process that many gov agencies use. They end up hiring companies who are experts in navigating that process vs companies who are experts in the actual competency required by the project.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#314

Post by joejerryronnie »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #300
imtringued wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone shops on amazon but everyone would have to install a government mandated app. You're overgeneralizing every human.

What if I have no app-capable smart and mobile device? Does the government provide me with one? Do I get an electronic ankle bracelet instead? What about a collar?

Government mandated implants are more efficient

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#315

Post by Reimersholme »

StreamBright wrote: post #265
barrenko wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. Big IT (which is highly creative stuff) cannot be built top-down, only bottom up. Europe is and will be an IT wasteland.

Living in the EU and working as a consultant for some time, I could not agree more. In 2020 when every major company and gov agency uses cloud computing there are still many companies in Germany who refuse to do so because of security. I mean nothing concrete or factual, just "because of security concerns". The same companies have weekly security breaches that they are not even aware of always, sometimes customers no…

This is popcorn money compared to the ‘Covid relief fund’ that is a thinly veiled attempt to save the Euro project at an extreme cost to non-euro countries.

Speaking about the most expensive shit shows in the EU that is.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#316

Post by pdimitar »

umvi wrote: post #252
ivanovb wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other part of E.U., in Romania, no matter what kind of business you want to start you need to battle with the bureaucracy. Out of high-tech domain, I was thinking that my grandma could sell the jam she makes - but she can't sell it legally if it's produced in her own house - no matter how low is the production. Maybe just at some kind of farmers market, but that is iffy. If I want to invoice some custom develo…

What's the point of having social safety nets if you can't exercise them taking risks? Seems like a crying shame.

Bold of you to assume there's a social safety net to speak of in Eastern Europe. It's only on paper.

You have to be a cripple or not worked for like a year or two in order to be eligible for some very minimal sum a month, and even that is taken away from you if you don't actively look for work and haven't found it in 6 to 18 months.

The whole thing is crafted in a way that unless you are living in shanty towns and rely on your relatives stealing food and clothes for you, then you will not want to descend that low on the social ladder just to get something like 200 EUR or so. And that implicit and indirect discouragement works really well; people just don't bother pursuing social help because it's meaningless and 99% of the time you won't get it anyway. Only the gypsies are persistent in it.

It's every man for himself here in EE. I am not complaining by the way; I've never known any other state of things so I don't actually care about social safety nets at all. But when we here in EE heard about the "Corona stimulus packages" (basically you get money because of the pandemic even if you didn't lose a job) then a lot of us couldn't help but laugh at the absurdity of the idea that something like that would ever happen here.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#317

Post by fierarul »

ivanovb wrote: post #189
petre wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The solution is de-regulation. In France if you want to run an open WiFi you need a license from the national comms authority for instance. But it won't happen. Too much bureaucracy. It's in the European mindset.

On the other part of E.U., in Romania, no matter what kind of business you want to start you need to battle with the bureaucracy. Out of high-tech domain, I was thinking that my grandma could sell the jam she makes - but she can't sell it legally if it's produced in her own house - no matter how low is the production. Maybe just at some kind of farmers market, but that is iffy. If I want to invoice some custom develo…

Bless you, so true.

And once you have a business set up then the fun starts. For extra sadism, try winding down your business!

I wonder if Europeans know US companies of much bigger dimensions are capable of keeping their own accounting and the sky is not falling. But in Romania, every month the accountant must get the paperwork, do the magical incantations (that nobody! reads). The Annual report even costs extra since it's more stuffy and it gets uploaded to the Finance Ministry so they get a chance to do nothing with it.

Sorry for the rant, I'm also traumatised by living here and knowing it could be different.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#318

Post by fierarul »

pdimitar wrote: post #316
umvi wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the point of having social safety nets if you can't exercise them taking risks? Seems like a crying shame.

Bold of you to assume there's a social safety net to speak of in Eastern Europe. It's only on paper. You have to be a cripple or not worked for like a year or two in order to be eligible for some very minimal sum a month, and even that is taken away from you if you don't actively look for work and haven't found it in 6 to 18 months. The whole thing is crafted in a way that unless you are living in shanty towns and re…

+1

There's only the social safety tax which you get clubbed if you don't pay. Other than that you are on your own and will pay out of pocket for whatever thing you imagine the safety net should have provided.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#319

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

joejerryronnie wrote: post #314
LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if I have no app-capable smart and mobile device? Does the government provide me with one? Do I get an electronic ankle bracelet instead? What about a collar?

Government mandated implants are more efficient

Can't wait to have this https://www.foxnews.com/story/saudi-killer-chip-implant-woul... can you? :)

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#320

Post by fierarul »

I often think it's part of the Western mentality to think what must be added to fix a problem.

These EU folks can't take a step back to see what could be removed to get there?

In an era of cheap money, when investors don't know where to put their money the EU believes tech needs state funding? Really?

#Bureaucracy

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