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The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
121–130 of 363 posts
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
I thought protests were democratic and A Good Thing™?
Assuming yes, are protests against democracy democratic? See also Paradox of Tolerance. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance
Yes, they are. If people don't want democracy then they should not have it.
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
The null hypothesis is that the differences between countries so far are more due to luck and timing than rationality and education. If that's correct then over the long run infection rates will roughly even out between most countries.
It’s unlike for all countries to have equivalent transmission rates by default. Further, countries with younger populations (specifically vs 75+) would have fewer death even if their adage adjusted mortality rates are identical. Italy has a much larger percentage of population over 80 than the rest of Europe due to climate, migration patterns, and WWII. Compare: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Germany#/…
Did you intentional link to "Population pyramid of Germany in 1933"? This is the most recent chart and it doesn't look that much better than Italy's: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Germany#/media...
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#124paywall-free: https://archive.is/bUQcv
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was referring to the guy who said "Societies with largely rational, educated populace are weathering COVID just fine, wrt. democracy and respect for human rights." My conclusion was that education does not equal to rationality with regards to human rights and that democracy is not good but it is the best system we had so far.
Sure. But China, arguably not much of a democracy did just fine. So the whole link between the pandemic and political systems is mostly nonsense, the countries where the impact is least are simply the ones that reacted fastest and most decisive. Everybody else is playing catch-up and they may have to substantially pause their 'freedoms' and 'democratic rights' to get through to the other side. This is a simple result…
So you believe in information that Chinese communist party is providing. A totalitarian regime with mass violation of human rights?! I love China and Chinese people but people suffer a lot under the rule of CCP. They are faking their financial data and they are faking their COVID data as well.
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
Societies with largely rational, educated populace are weathering COVID just fine, wrt. democracy and respect for human rights.
I'd argue there's no direct correlation. There are societies with lesser regard for rationality doing just fine too. Several countries not in "the path of the storm" can claim credit for anything they did and didn't do as having stopped covid to the point of superstition. Id credit Germans' preference of beer just as much as their February/March response or their penchant for rationality. It's a form of collective su…
There’s another difference. The US healthcare system has strong incentives to find COVID where there is none, or where it’s irrelevant. They get substantially more money from a COVID death than from a normal death. A guy I know lost his friend to a motorcycle accident, but his friend’s death was officially a COVID death.
When you see really strong outliers, you need to at least consider the explanatory power of incentives.
I think the US has mismanaged the crisis, but I also think there are plenty of reasons to be skeptical about the numbers.
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
> you cannot compare right in Brazil with Nazi Period Is it true or not that Bolsonaro is against democracy and rallied against it or not? Can you find a moment when French or German president said something like "the military must be back in power"? The last time it happened in Europe was when nazi ruled, or when in Spain the fascist ruled, or when in Greece the fascists ruled etc. etc. I think the comparison is apt…
It’s the opposite. He’s literally arming the population to prevent a future totalitarian takeover: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/31/world/americas/guns-brazi... Dictators don’t encourage their people to be able to defend themselves.
That's just "2nd ammendment" propaganda that he borrowed from the United States.
It's patently clear that he'd go for a totalitarian takeover himself if he could. He just hasn't yet because he did not have the means to do so.
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Rational, educated populace doesnt explain away the difference between Italy vs Austria, Belgium & Netherlands vs Germany, the US vs Canada In the case of US vs Canada, perhaps it does. Canadians have a high level of trust in expert civil servants, including public health officials. There is also a general Canadian pragmatism that kicks in: politicians from across the country and across the political spectrum have…
Isn’t Ontario and Quebec going through a massive 2nd wave right now? And there have been protests against the restrictions including one on Parliament Hill. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/covid-19-rally-ottawa-1.570...
The protests have been very small, despite the media doing their best to promote them.
If you look at someone like Doug Ford, the extremely conservative, pro-business premier of Ontario, he has consistently advocated for masking and lockdowns as needed. He was tight-fisted with funds for testing, and overly eager to reopen businesses before fall/winter when outdoor dining would be untenable. That set the stage for our current outbreak, but he hasn't done anything on the level of Trump or Rick Scott.
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd argue there's no direct correlation. There are societies with lesser regard for rationality doing just fine too. Several countries not in "the path of the storm" can claim credit for anything they did and didn't do as having stopped covid to the point of superstition. Id credit Germans' preference of beer just as much as their February/March response or their penchant for rationality. It's a form of collective su…
I haven’t really understood the certain praise the EU has received by the USA media. The EU as a whole is similar to the USA and has done just as good/bad as the USA. Similar number of deaths. The USA has more cases but I suspect the EU has just not tested as much previously. There’s no reason to suspect the EU would have a higher death rate (USA has more confirmed cases but fewer deaths$. But today EU case totals ar…
This utopian view of the EU predates COVID. I’m not sure where it comes from.
Re: The pandemic has eroded democracy and respect for human rights
#130In this forum, right here on HN, people routinely espouse desire for more authoritarian restrictions. People gleefully discuss Sweden and almost openly hope that their lockdown-free plan fails.
The article makes it sound as if the erosion of democracy is coming from the top. In the USA, it’s coming from the bottom. It’s coming from everyday citizens.