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Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

atlassian.com

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Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#181

Post by thu2111 »

originalvichy wrote: post #10

This sounds like a terrible move and will probably force all medium-size organizations I work with to ditch Atlassian. We have the technical know-how to administer data center versions of their products, but we can’t do shit if they force potential customers to pay for a minimum of 40 000 USD for a license per product. Many of these orgs have multiple Atlassian products so this will probably end up doubling costs on…

It already exists. JetBrains YouTrack has an on-site version with similar features to Jira, and the latest version comes with a wiki feature called Knowledge Base. [1]

There's also an automatic import process from Jira [2].

YouTrack has a cloud version now. Unfortunately they used the introduction of this to raise the prices for their self-hosted version. However they do allow migration both to and from the cloud version, and they plan to introduce a self-hosted version of their newest Space product, so it seems JetBrains is more DIY friendly than Atlassian.

JB seem like a better company anyway. It's hard to forget Atlassian's decision to stop rewarding employees based on merit, a system they claimed was created by "white men" [3]. The new system rewards employees largely for following the "company values". Under the company values page [4], they claim one of their values is "Don’t #@!% the customer". Interesting way to show it.

[1] https://www.jetbrains.com/help/youtrack/standalone/Getting-S...

[2] https://www.jetbrains.com/help/youtrack/standalone/importing...

[3] https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/at-work/atlassian-ditch...

[4] https://www.atlassian.com/company/values

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#182

Post by dragonwriter »

ozim wrote: post #179
originalvichy wrote: post #10

This sounds like a terrible move and will probably force all medium-size organizations I work with to ditch Atlassian. We have the technical know-how to administer data center versions of their products, but we can’t do shit if they force potential customers to pay for a minimum of 40 000 USD for a license per product. Many of these orgs have multiple Atlassian products so this will probably end up doubling costs on…

Microsoft is doing the same with Azure DevOps and big orgs with sensitive data are moving there as well. I don't think you can even have Azure DevOps on premise. So Atlassian is doing it because they know there is no competitor that would jump in. Because everyone else also goes that direction.

> I don't think you can even have Azure DevOps on premise.

https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/services/devops/server/

“Previously known as Team Foundation Server (TFS), Azure DevOps Server is a set of collaborative software development tools, hosted on-premises.”

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#183

Post by brunojppb »

Our org started using BitBucket cloud for a major project. The developer experience is light years behind Gitlab and Github. We are moving our entire pipeline to Gitlab instead. The difference in productivity and experience using Gitlab is shocking compared to Bitbucket. Their React app, while cool, is painfully slow, PR reviews are very clunky and there is no code highlighting on diffs.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#184

Post by six2seven »

castillar76 wrote: post #109
justin_oaks wrote: post #17

Are there good self-hosted alternatives for those of use who'd like to get off of Atlassian products? For Bamboo, I immediately think of Jenkins, although it's showing its age now. For Confluence, I think of Media Wiki. For BitBucket, I think of self-hosted GitLab. Not sure about Jira or Service Desk, though. I'd appreciate any better suggestions.

The problem is that a lot of people will reach for Gitlab to replace Jira, or MediaWiki/Dokuwiki (or again, Gitlab) to replace Confluence. But for businesses that have adapted business processes to use them, Gitlab/MediaWiki/Dokuwiki simply don't cut the mustard. We have an extensively customized Jira installation that's used for tracking budget requests, cage access tickets, and system change requests--none of those…

  The thing Atlassian had going for them is that we could get our non-technical people to use their stuff, understand it, and even customize it themselves to meet their needs.
This. Although personally I have never been a big fan of clunky Atlassian products and as a developer would prefer more productive tools, but getting key non-technical stakeholders use the same system as devs teams is a big win.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#185

Post by thu2111 »

jeff_redradish wrote: post #102

For any soon-to-be-ex Atlassian Server (self-hosted) customers, I've set up a Zulip server for discussing alternatives: https://chat.goodbyeserver.org/ It's an difficult position Atlassian are inflicting on tens of thousands of customers. Atlassian's self-hosted products are uniquely flexible, being built on a plugin architecture, and many orgs have indeed customized Jira extensively with plugins, notably ScriptRunne…

I promoted it upthread (though I have no connection to JetBrains), but I'd note that YouTrack and their other team products have extensive Java and REST plugin APIs so they're also very customisable. Actually YouTrack lets you write workflow logic in JavaScript too.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#186

Post by octodog »

raverbashing wrote: post #144
AlphaSite wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you be worse than JIRA? Thats almost impressive.

People are spoiled. JIRA sucks, but it sucks compared to more lightweight tools and the modern aesthetic It outperforms previous tracking tools like bugzilla, trac, or those proprietary piles of crap like the "Rational" tools

Can you give me some examples of tools that are better? Genuinely curious.

I've used JIRA at multiple workplaces and really enjoy it. I like Github issues and Trello for my personal task/issue tracking but I don't think they're suitable for more complex projects.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#187

Post by user5994461 »

mongol wrote: post #153
pjmlp wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite easy, I have am been around for 30+ years in IT and have yet to find something that beats Jira in all its integration options, possibilities of formating tickets information, and flexibility to definie project specific workflows. Given the option, I will always push for Jira, and associated Atlassian products.

Indeed. Compare Jira with ServiceNow and it is like night and day. They serve different purposes, but Jira is friendly and SN almost hostile.

They're both tools to build forms. How horrible the forms are is really up to your organization. Whether they force you to fill 50 mandatory fields or not.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#188

Post by laurent92 »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #62
Jedd wrote: post #7

We're using Jira, Confluence, and BitBucket on-prem at our DC now, on some pretty sizeable VM's with good network connectivity back to head office. Despite that, it feels very slow. Not the occasional 10+ second page load, where you've accidentally clicked something that happens to generate a cascade of cache misses. I can forgive that kind of infrequent performance hiccup. But rather, regular usage, especially of Co…

Yep:) At a previous job, we also did Jira/Confluence/BitBucket self-hosted, running on what should have been nice hardware, and spent months chasing performance issues, including a charming issue that was so bad that it broke jira for the entire company every... Monday, I think? When you have a well-used standard operating procedure for restarting Jira just to unfreeze it, you have a problem. We were pretty sure it w…

Well they certainly noticed companies running their own Jira hurt the image of Atlassian, and stopped offering the service altogether. It would be a knee-jerk reaction but possible.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#189

Post by thu2111 »

chillfox wrote: post #85
Spivak wrote: post #15

Ouch, on-prem software is a really tough business. I can kinda see why companies want out. Especially as they get bigger. Two of my former employers had to go through this hurdle of moving to SaaS from a an on-prem installation. * It's really hard to scale support. You end up being on the hook for why "it's not working" in thousands of different of environments you have zero control over. Anyone qualified to do that…

"please update" is kinda the "try restarting" equivalent for sysadmins. And people get angry because it is usually delivered in a "I have no idea if it will work" kinda way. All you would have to do to make people calmly accept that they need to update is explaining why, so you know do the minimum and search the issue tracker so you can tell them that this is actually a known problem that was fixed in version x.y.z a…

Yeah, but most software updates have so many bug fixes and performance improvements it's unreasonably expensive to give people a justification for each upgrade request, especially when - as noted - customers accept forced upgrades without any notice at all, when something isn't self hosted.

I think this is a fundamental issue with the software world: there aren't enough skilled sysadmins left anymore (how many people even call themselves sysadmins these days), so the more options users have the more ways to get things wrong they'll find. The vague, open ended nature of "support" means it ends up being an unsatisfactory experience. When the only people who need support are the in-house devops team, it's a lot easier.

Unfortunately there don't seem to be good solutions for this. If users aren't given choices, they may leave or never turn up at all, but once that pain is over they won't be unhappy again (unless you have a major outage). Give them choices and when things blow up they'll become an angry unhappy customer with a support contract, which is every businesses worst nightmare.

Re: Atlassian moving to cloud-only, will stop selling server licenses

#190

Post by tupputuppu »

manicdee wrote: post #152

Data sovereignty means my 5,000 seat company will stop using it. Confluence and Jira were already a hard sell due to licence fees. Now Atlassian wants us to put our trade secrets on AWS or something? Not happening. At least they if we mess up security on a host inside our business it’s not the end of the world. edit: I don’t make the money decisions here, I am just a peon.

For 95% of companies, outsourcing your servers to the cloud is a drastic security improvement.
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